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- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Mick still has the Rolling Stones. Watch the documentary Crossfire Hurricane currently showing on HBO, they were amazing and Mick kept the band first.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Still...on the good side...if Chris has this "anti-axl" agenda it clears the way for him to become the new VR frontman....
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Mikkamakka wrote:I know that they have issues. Mick has with Keith, Keith has with Mick. I don't doubt they are not friends anymore. Mick is egomaniac, for sure. Keith was/is a druggie and a heavy drinker. But they are still together, because Mick, whatever an ass boss he can be, makes (t)his band functioning. Because he maybe a dictator, but a reliable one. These people can build empires. The disfunctionals leave mess behind them and not much to remember, except the feuds.
Or you could look at it another way. GASP! Maybe Keith was the smart one for sticking with Mick, despite all their differences. As opposed to
Just saying. There's two sides to every story. (this is the point where you bring up the numerous people who have turned their back against Axl over the years so obviously it's HIS fault, and not theirs). Thought I'd save you the time.
Legit point, but I think Mick has never pushed Keith close to a suicide situation with his antics, unlike our guy did. There is a huge list how Axl forced Slash to quit the band.
Also, don't forget that everyone else left, not only Slash, while Stones had less line-up changes, even in 50 years.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Obviously there are a lot of twists and turns to the plot, but it's hard to say who was right or who was wrong. If things would've worked out better or worse if different decisions were made. What happened happened, and we have had to deal with the fallout.
Personally, I think Axl would have been willing to continue a working relationship with Slash, albeit with basically total control. Obviously that didn't seem to appeal to Slash, and you can't really blame him for that. BUT, it was an option, at least it seems. He chose to go a different direction and maintain control himself, rather than turn it over to someone else. They both have/had HUGE egos, and they clashed. A long term working relationship under those circumstances was unlikely. At least from my perception.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
The point of no return was the night and Duff signed over the rights to 
. When Axl pulled the rug a few years later and Slash realized he was suddenly just an employee, he countered by simply refusing to do anything the boss asked. Knowing full well his actual value in the band was more than that of a mere subordinate.
Obviously that was not quite the case as Axl was more than willing to work around a lot of issues, but it was his way of trying to rectify the position he found himself in.
I'm not sure if he as much left as it just got to the point where he stopped coming around, and then Axl put out the press release saying he was no longer considered to be part of the band. Either way he miscalculated as Axl was eyeballing replacements quickly thereafter. Slash's response to that was to sling shit in the media and that was all she wrote.
It's not about the blame, it is about what happened. 5 kids, all content to go live in the slums of LA. Already we know quite a bit about their characters. In between the sex and the drugs they write a few songs and play a couple of shows. Suddenly they're the biggest act in the world. Getting 900.000 dollar checks and don't even have a bank accounts. For 4 of them that meant an eternal party until they couldn't take it anymore. Izzy checked out in 91, Duff in 94, Slash sometime around 2006 and Steven appears to still be doing it.
Like Izzy said, this guy ain't no college degree or nothing like that. He's a dropout that wrote a few songs and now he's in the middle of a 100 million dollar operation. He sees his band mates partying like there's no tomorrow and there's a growing entourage of vultures egging him on he needs to get on top of this thing. Cause naturally, if they only have to convince one person of their various schemes their job becomes a lot easier.
It turns out they weren't all that wrong either. Within a few years they already had an ex drummer, who's suing for millions. Then the rythm guitarist decides to quit in the middle of a world tour to beat his drug addiction. The two remaining ones just want to continue the party and let him have it.
Axl shouldn't have tried to take over the band, the others shouldn't have let him. But it happened, because they were young, stupid and selfish with too much money in their hands. Only thing I think could be done differently was the way the rest of the band used the press against Axl after the fact. That burned a lot of bridges, especially for Slash.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
All that said, Slash has won..... Slash wins because without him in GNR, GNR will never be seen as GNR... Axl and Slash both know this. So in essence, Slash is the winner, his value is finally realized by all.. If anyone should do any "begging" its Axl... Slash don't need Axl, GNR needs Slash to be considered "legit" by the masses. If or when that happens, GNR will come back like nobodies business... They wouldn't need to do but one show like the 2007 O2 arena Led Zep show then record a few songs and bam, they are back. Axl's vocal limitations live would now be a concern... Unlike Mick Jagger and Biran Johnson, Axl can't sing his entire back catalog at that high of a level, but in the studio he can.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Without saying anything negative about Axl (Rose), what I remember most is that Duff (McKagan) and Slash and the rest of the people were normal people, friendly and warm in a rock band that just wanted to rock. And then, as if this character to the 'Wizard of Oz' behind the curtain that seemed to complicate what was the most ideal situation in which it could be: were the most successful rock band in the world and famous. At every concert, hundreds of thousands of fans wanted to hear their songs. For some reason, there seemed to be an obstacle to come out and participate in that. That's what I remember most. It's sad.
LOL, he sort of points to what made GNR such a success. A mentally insane singer with a sick talent.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
The point of no return was the night
Is that what happened though?
I'm sure slash was pissy about a few issues but I just got the impression it was communication between them that broke down.
What did he refuse to do? He's not an industrial guitarist, and he didn't quit after huge re-recorded his solo, and then he presented Axl with enough material for an entire album (snakepit1) that he says Axl rejected.
Axl's version is that he was told take it or leave it without changes....so it's possible maybe slash was encouraging Axl to hurry up as he wanted to get back out on the road and didn't want a chinese democracy style wait.
But I've never heard of Slash outright refusing to do stuff, even the UYI ballads he ended up playing on despite wanting a rock act, and he tollerated Dizzy being in the band despite originally not wanting a full time keys player.
But it's Axl who started not showing up in the studio, then rejecting music brought to him.
Also...I'm not so sure about this "trashing Axl in the press" thing people go on about...Axl trashes himself in the press when he walks off stage..when he fights with fans...when he shows up to a gig 2 hours late...all Slash did was stop apologising for these things once he'd left the band.
And that WAS slash's role. I remember when they came here in 93 and Slash was interviewed on the local nightly current affairs program and it was endless questions about how the band was racist, homophobic, starts riots, comes out late, pisses in planes, are a bunch of junkies. And only one of those problems was something Slash actually caused - but he's all friendly on the TV and parents let their kids go to the show.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
The point of no return was the night
Obviously that was not quite the case as Axl was more than willing to work around a lot of issues, but it was his way of trying to rectify the position he found himself in.I'm not sure if he as much left as it just got to the point where he stopped coming around, and then Axl put out the press release saying he was no longer considered to be part of the band. Either way he miscalculated as Axl was eyeballing replacements quickly thereafter. Slash's response to that was to sling shit in the media and that was all she wrote.
It's not about the blame, it is about what happened. 5 kids, all content to go live in the slums of LA. Already we know quite a bit about their characters. In between the sex and the drugs they write a few songs and play a couple of shows. Suddenly they're the biggest act in the world. Getting 900.000 dollar checks and don't even have a bank accounts. For 4 of them that meant an eternal party until they couldn't take it anymore. Izzy checked out in 91, Duff in 94, Slash sometime around 2006 and Steven appears to still be doing it.
Like Izzy said, this guy ain't no college degree or nothing like that. He's a dropout that wrote a few songs and now he's in the middle of a 100 million dollar operation. He sees his band mates partying like there's no tomorrow and there's a growing entourage of vultures egging him on he needs to get on top of this thing. Cause naturally, if they only have to convince one person of their various schemes their job becomes a lot easier.
It turns out they weren't all that wrong either. Within a few years they already had an ex drummer, who's suing for millions. Then the rythm guitarist decides to quit in the middle of a world tour to beat his drug addiction. The two remaining ones just want to continue the party and let him have it.
Axl shouldn't have tried to take over the band, the others shouldn't have let him. But it happened, because they were young, stupid and selfish with too much money in their hands. Only thing I think could be done differently was the way the rest of the band used the press against Axl after the fact. That burned a lot of bridges, especially for Slash.
Good post all things considered. Monkey pointed out things, so I'd only add that Axl organized those huge parties (you know, every night a different scene, like Ancient Rome etc.), he needed a private plane, he spent shitloads of money on videos to express his feelings with dolphins, and he forced the band to pay fortunes for curfews and riots.
They all had their faults and Axl cannot be blamed 100% for what happened with the band. But it's crystal clear that he lost his common sense, maybe even himself during the UYI days. He had no feet on the ground, he hated the tour, his bandmtes, the whole world. That killed Guns N' Roses. He had the chance to relaunch his career and redefine Guns N' Roses, but we all know how this turned out and he still hasn't grown up to take responsibility, but blames Slash for taking away 15 years of his life. That's why there is no hope for progress in GN'R land.
