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Re: US Politics Thread
I think the more important question is how often/when we've allowed fake knowledge to influence our own line of thinking.
RF and SG are just as guilty as I or anyone else. That map of the election by county is pure propaganda that was posted by the Trump supporters.
I no longer click on mother jones articles.
I am much more critical of my news sources than I ever was....
But none of this explains/justifies Trump....
Paul Ryan is continually sucking his dick in the media. Should I believe that?
Re: US Politics Thread
polluxlm wrote:Can we have an agreement we will no longer post unsubstantiated stories from murky, unknown and plain out crazy news websites?
That's going to leave you short of sources I think.
Unless you really meant to say "websites not pushing a liberal narrative".
That would rob them of anything from Media Matters, Salon, HuffPo, Vox and MotherJones to name a few. Then any of their random OpEd pieces where some parent who promised their child the world is now in tears and telling their kid to stay strong as they're sent to Auschwitz.
This is absurd RF...you were posting plenty of fake news and even blogs last summer.
I think it's time we all take responsibility.
Re: US Politics Thread
His supporters are ignorant knuckle draggers and deserve every bad thing the Pence administration will give them. Trump is playing the rubes, he actually has shown compassion to Hillary outside the moron fests of his rallies. Pence is 100% true blue right wing Christian crazy nut job, and appears to be in full control of the decision making. All the people getting positions are Pence people.
They are going to love the free range Paul Ryan gets to gut Medicare. While all these rubes are shouting about Hillary, they are slowly working on dismantling one of our most important safety nets for seniors. Trump supporters will be doctor shopping with vouchers all while their prostates are protruding out of their asses. They deserve it...the rest of us do not.
Trump said during his entire campaign that Hillary was "crooked" because of her alleged (never found guilty) inability to handle classified material. Then has Petraeus in the running for Secretary of State, who actually pled guilty and is currently still on probation...for mishandling classified material.
Trump and his cohorts bemoaned Hillary's speaking engagements with Goldman Sachs. But guess who Trump's Secretary of Treasury is? Steve Mnuchin from Goldman Sachs.
Trump's charges against Hillary in regards to "crony capitalism" was core in his campaign as well. It should also be noted that this is a fundamental aspect of Republican dogma (especially over the last 8 years.) "Let the chips fall where they may." "Government doesn't create jobs." "Government doesn't pick winners and losers." But what is the first thing President elect Trump does, and the majority of Republicans cheer? He works out a "deal" with Carrier, using their parent company's government contracts as leverage. A deal that costs tax payers over 7 million dollars, although we still do not have all the details. Sure sounds like crony capitalism to me.
Trump also has a trillion dollar infrastructure stimulus in the works. They voted against that for 8 years. Want to guess what happens now that Trump is in the driver's seat?
Trump supporters are either acutely unaware of any of this, or simply don't care. My guess is a little bit of both. What I've seen here more than anything is that Trump can say/do anything, even literally change his stance mid sentence. They could care less. More than that are the conservative values they have claimed to hold so dear. None of that apparently matters anymore either. Carrier is a good example. His supporters don't see any hypocrisy on their end or Trump's. And Trump will use it again and again to show what a deal-maker he is and that he kept his campaign promises. None of the facts will matter, not one bit.
I voted for Kasich but lately he has acted like a little bitch.
I'd say it was the other way around.
Kasich was the only Republican to show backbone and integrity. The rest loathed Trump, but fell in line like cowards rather than possibly alienate any of their constiuents.
- Randall Flagg
- Rep: 139
Re: US Politics Thread
Randall Flagg wrote:polluxlm wrote:That's going to leave you short of sources I think.
Unless you really meant to say "websites not pushing a liberal narrative".
That would rob them of anything from Media Matters, Salon, HuffPo, Vox and MotherJones to name a few. Then any of their random OpEd pieces where some parent who promised their child the world is now in tears and telling their kid to stay strong as they're sent to Auschwitz.
This is absurd RF...you were posting plenty of fake news and even blogs last summer.
I think it's time we all take responsibility.
I don't recall linking blogs outside of Coulter and I don't think I've ever linked to a questionable news source for the same reasons mentioned above. And I'm not saying that anything on Salon is automatically false. But when your only support that Bannon is a member of the alt-right is a reporter from Mother Jones, that doesn't pass the legitimacy test to me.
The only bullshit news I've fallen victim to and a good friend called me out were the claims of Democrats paying protesters. Plenty of evidence to show Unions doing that, but not a single piece of evidence tying it to the Democratic party.
Re: US Politics Thread
mitchejw wrote:Randall Flagg wrote:That would rob them of anything from Media Matters, Salon, HuffPo, Vox and MotherJones to name a few. Then any of their random OpEd pieces where some parent who promised their child the world is now in tears and telling their kid to stay strong as they're sent to Auschwitz.
This is absurd RF...you were posting plenty of fake news and even blogs last summer.
I think it's time we all take responsibility.
I don't recall linking blogs outside of Coulter and I don't think I've ever linked to a questionable news source for the same reasons mentioned above. And I'm not saying that anything on Salon is automatically false. But when your only support that Bannon is a member of the alt-right is a reporter from Mother Jones, that doesn't pass the legitimacy test to me.
The only bullshit news I've fallen victim to and a good friend called me out were the claims of Democrats paying protesters. Plenty of evidence to show Unions doing that, but not a single piece of evidence tying it to the Democratic party.
Well let me try and be a good friend and say that we all let our strongest beliefs blind us into believing things that aren't true...
I'm just saying that we owe it to each other and ourselves to make sure we know what we're saying is based on truth.
Re: US Politics Thread
misterID wrote:His supporters are ignorant knuckle draggers and deserve every bad thing the Pence administration will give them. Trump is playing the rubes, he actually has shown compassion to Hillary outside the moron fests of his rallies. Pence is 100% true blue right wing Christian crazy nut job, and appears to be in full control of the decision making. All the people getting positions are Pence people.
They are going to love the free range Paul Ryan gets to gut Medicare. While all these rubes are shouting about Hillary, they are slowly working on dismantling one of our most important safety nets for seniors. Trump supporters will be doctor shopping with vouchers all while their prostates are protruding out of their asses. They deserve it...the rest of us do not.
Trump said during his entire campaign that Hillary was "crooked" because of her alleged (never found guilty) inability to handle classified material. Then has Petraeus in the running for Secretary of State, who actually pled guilty and is currently still on probation...for mishandling classified material.
Trump and his cohorts bemoaned Hillary's speaking engagements with Goldman Sachs. But guess who Trump's Secretary of Treasury is? Steve Mnuchin from Goldman Sachs.
Trump's charges against Hillary in regards to "crony capitalism" was core in his campaign as well. It should also be noted that this is a fundamental aspect of Republican dogma (especially over the last 8 years.) "Let the chips fall where they may." "Government doesn't create jobs." "Government doesn't pick winners and losers." But what is the first thing President elect Trump does, and the majority of Republicans cheer? He works out a "deal" with Carrier, using their parent company's government contracts as leverage. A deal that costs tax payers over 7 million dollars, although we still do not have all the details. Sure sounds like crony capitalism to me.
Trump also has a trillion dollar infrastructure stimulus in the works. They voted against that for 8 years. Want to guess what happens now that Trump is in the driver's seat?
Trump supporters are either acutely unaware of any of this, or simply don't care. My guess is a little bit of both. What I've seen here more than anything is that Trump can say/do anything, even literally change his stance mid sentence. They could care less. More than that are the conservative values they have claimed to hold so dear. None of that apparently matters anymore either. Carrier is a good example. His supporters don't see any hypocrisy on their end or Trump's. And Trump will use it again and again to show what a deal-maker he is and that he kept his campaign promises. None of the facts will matter, not one bit.
Smoking Guns wrote:I voted for Kasich but lately he has acted like a little bitch.
I'd say it was the other way around.
Kasich was the only Republican to show backbone and integrity. The rest loathed Trump, but fell in line like cowards rather than possibly alienate any of their constiuents.
I cannot even begin to understand the complexity of what Paul Ryan is proposing at the moment.
Hypothetical though: what if Medicaid was abolished and the money used to fund it was some how used to subsidize private health insurance.
Re: US Politics Thread
Donald Trump: TIME Person of the Year
Even for Donald Trump, the distance is still fun to think about, up here in his penthouse 600 ft. in the sky, where it’s hard to make out the regular people below. The ice skaters swarming Central Park’s Wollman Rink look like old-television static, and the Fifth Avenue holiday shoppers could be mites in a gutter. To even see this view, elevator operators, who spend their days standing in place, must push a button marked 66–68, announcing all three floors of Trump’s princely pad. Inside, staff members wear cloth slipcovers on their shoes, so as not to scuff the shiny marble or stain the plush cream carpets.
This is, in short, not a natural place to refine the common touch. It’s gilded and gaudy, a dreamscape of faded tapestry, antique clocks and fresco-style ceiling murals of gym-rat Greek gods. The throw pillows carry the Trump shield, and the paper napkins are monogrammed with the family name. His closest neighbors, at least at this altitude, are an international set of billionaire moguls who have decided to stash their money at One57 and 432 Park, the two newest skyscrapers to remake midtown Manhattan. There is no tight-knit community in the sky, no paperboy or postman, no bowling over brews after work.
And yet here Trump resides, under dripping crystal, with diamond cuff links, as the President-elect of the United States of America. The Secret Service agents milling about prove that it really happened, this election result few saw coming. Hulking and serious, they gingerly try to stay on the marble, avoiding the carpets with their uncovered shoes. On his wife Melania’s desk, next to books of Gianni Versace’s fashions and Elizabeth Taylor’s jewelry, a new volume sits front and center: The White House: Its Historic Furnishings and First Families.
For all of Trump’s public life, tastemakers and intellectuals have dismissed him as a vulgarian and carnival barker, a showman with big flash and little substance. But what those critics never understood was that their disdain gave him strength. For years, he fed off the disrespect and used it to grab more tabloid headlines, to connect to common people. Now he has upended the leadership of both major political parties and effectively shifted the political direction of the international order. He will soon command history’s most lethal military, along with economic levers that can change the lives of billions. And the people he has to thank are those he calls “the forgotten,” millions of American voters who get paid by the hour in shoes that will never touch these carpets—working folk, regular Janes and Joes, the dots in the distance.
It’s a topic Trump wants to discuss as he settles down in his dining room, with its two-story ceiling and marble table the length of a horseshoe pitch: the winning margins he achieved in West Virginia coal country, the rally crowds that swelled on Election Day, what he calls that “interesting thing,” the contradiction at the core of his appeal. “What amazes a lot of people is that I’m sitting in an apartment the likes of which nobody’s ever seen,” the next President says, smiling. “And yet I represent the workers of the world.”
The late Fidel Castro would probably spit out his cigar if he heard that one—a billionaire who branded excess claiming the slogans of the proletariat. But Trump doesn’t care. “I’m representing them, and they love me and I love them,” he continues, talking about the people of Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania, the struggling Rust Belt necklace around the Great Lakes that delivered his victory. “And here we sit, in very different circumstances.”
The Last, Greatest Deal
For nearly 17 months on the campaign trail, Trump did what no American politician had attempted in a generation, with defiant flair. Instead of painting a bright vision for a unified future, he magnified the divisions of the present, inspiring new levels of anger and fear within his country. Whatever you think of the man, this much is undeniable: he uncovered an opportunity others didn’t believe existed, the last, greatest deal for a 21st century salesman. The national press, the late-night comics, the elected leaders, the donors, the corporate chiefs and a sitting President who prematurely dropped his mic—they all believed he was just taking the country for a ride.
Now it’s difficult to count all the ways Trump remade the game: the huckster came off more real than the scripted political pros. The cable-news addict made pollsters look like chumps. The fabulist out-shouted journalists fighting to separate fact from falsehood. The demagogue won more Latino and black votes than the 2012 Republican nominee.
Trump found a way to woo white evangelicals by historic margins, even winning those who attend religious services every week. Despite boasting on video of sexually assaulting women, he still found a way to win white females by 9 points. As a champion of federal entitlements for the poor, tariffs on China and health care “for everybody,” he dominated among self-described conservatives. In a country that seemed to be bending toward its demographic future, with many straining to finally step outside the darker cycles of history, he proved that tribal instincts never die, that in times of economic strife and breakneck social change, a charismatic leader could still find the enemy within and rally the masses to his side. In the weeks after his victory, hundreds of incidents of harassment, many using his name—against women, Muslims, immigrants and racial minorities—were reported across the country.
The starting point for his success, which can be measured with just tens of thousands of votes, was the most obvious recipe in politics. He identified the central issue motivating the American electorate and then convinced a plurality of the voters in the states that mattered that he was the best person to bring change. “The greatest jobs theft in the history of the world” was his cause, “I alone can fix it” his unlikely selling point, “great again” his rallying cry.
Since the bungled Iraq War faded into the rearview mirror, there has been only one defining issue in American presidential politics, spanning party and ideology. It’s the reason Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren thunders that “the system is rigged” by the banks, and Vermont’s Bernie Sanders got so much traction denouncing the greed of “millionaires and billionaires.” It’s what Marco Rubio meant when he said, “We are losing the American Dream,” and why Jeb Bush claimed everyone has a “right to rise.”
http://time.com/time-person-of-the-year … ald-trump/
And since we're talking TIME magazine, I have a little treat for you anti-Trumpers:
Re: US Politics Thread
misterID wrote:His supporters are ignorant knuckle draggers and deserve every bad thing the Pence administration will give them. Trump is playing the rubes, he actually has shown compassion to Hillary outside the moron fests of his rallies. Pence is 100% true blue right wing Christian crazy nut job, and appears to be in full control of the decision making. All the people getting positions are Pence people.
They are going to love the free range Paul Ryan gets to gut Medicare. While all these rubes are shouting about Hillary, they are slowly working on dismantling one of our most important safety nets for seniors. Trump supporters will be doctor shopping with vouchers all while their prostates are protruding out of their asses. They deserve it...the rest of us do not.
Trump said during his entire campaign that Hillary was "crooked" because of her alleged (never found guilty) inability to handle classified material. Then has Petraeus in the running for Secretary of State, who actually pled guilty and is currently still on probation...for mishandling classified material.
Trump and his cohorts bemoaned Hillary's speaking engagements with Goldman Sachs. But guess who Trump's Secretary of Treasury is? Steve Mnuchin from Goldman Sachs.
Trump's charges against Hillary in regards to "crony capitalism" was core in his campaign as well. It should also be noted that this is a fundamental aspect of Republican dogma (especially over the last 8 years.) "Let the chips fall where they may." "Government doesn't create jobs." "Government doesn't pick winners and losers." But what is the first thing President elect Trump does, and the majority of Republicans cheer? He works out a "deal" with Carrier, using their parent company's government contracts as leverage. A deal that costs tax payers over 7 million dollars, although we still do not have all the details. Sure sounds like crony capitalism to me.
Trump also has a trillion dollar infrastructure stimulus in the works. They voted against that for 8 years. Want to guess what happens now that Trump is in the driver's seat?
Trump supporters are either acutely unaware of any of this, or simply don't care. My guess is a little bit of both. What I've seen here more than anything is that Trump can say/do anything, even literally change his stance mid sentence. They could care less. More than that are the conservative values they have claimed to hold so dear. None of that apparently matters anymore either. Carrier is a good example. His supporters don't see any hypocrisy on their end or Trump's. And Trump will use it again and again to show what a deal-maker he is and that he kept his campaign promises. None of the facts will matter, not one bit.
Smoking Guns wrote:I voted for Kasich but lately he has acted like a little bitch.
I'd say it was the other way around.
Kasich was the only Republican to show backbone and integrity. The rest loathed Trump, but fell in line like cowards rather than possibly alienate any of their constiuents.
I totally agree with this...it's way more difficult to stand with your principals than jump on the Trump bandwagon.
Even worse, that troll of a human being, Paul Ryan straddled the fence and jumped onto both sides of it before straddling the fence coming into the election.
Now that he benefits, he's all smiles. Now there's a man who stands for nothing.
- Randall Flagg
- Rep: 139
Re: US Politics Thread
No outrage over Pelosi staying in a Minority Leader? Her only accomplishment in 10 years was barely getting Obamacare through the House. Now she's talking about stopping some of Trump's cabinet nominations. Maybe she should read the constitution because the House has no say on appointments. She's literally the least powerful person of note in the Democratic party.
