You are not logged in. Please register or login.
- Topics: Active | Unanswered
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
elevendayempire wrote:monkeychow wrote:Don't forget to add the "Axl Tax" which is 2 years to each of those dates
Arguably one of the biggest factors in the delayed release of Chinese Democracy was that the label didn't fully buy into the idea of Axl's rebooted GN'R.
I don't think this is a fair statement. The ONLY reason for the delay was Axl.
From 1995-1998 any rebooted-GnR really didn't do anything close to releasing an album. In 1999 with OMG the label wanted a record. In 2002 with the MTV appearance & following tour the label wanted a record. In 2006 the leaks happened, yet Axl seemingly never turned in the masters. Then we got it in 2007.
So let's not blame 12 years on the label.
They turned the record in at least 2 times before it was released.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
PaSnow wrote:elevendayempire wrote:Arguably one of the biggest factors in the delayed release of Chinese Democracy was that the label didn't fully buy into the idea of Axl's rebooted GN'R.
I don't think this is a fair statement. The ONLY reason for the delay was Axl.
From 1995-1998 any rebooted-GnR really didn't do anything close to releasing an album. In 1999 with OMG the label wanted a record. In 2002 with the MTV appearance & following tour the label wanted a record. In 2006 the leaks happened, yet Axl seemingly never turned in the masters. Then we got it in 2007.
So let's not blame 12 years on the label.
They turned the record in at least 2 times before it was released.
Yeah, Tommy Stinson would disagree and put a great deal of blame on the label for the delay. Not to say Axl didn't play his part, I'm sure he did. But it's the whole chicken or egg argument.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
I think it's the label AND Axl.
Like the label rejects the album AS IS - which they would do to a lot of bands who fundamentally changed their sound and altered the classic line up with players in a very different style.
But rather than work up new songs Axl goes into a spiral of self doubt and begins redoing things over and over. Also - Axl's way of recording caused the release to become important to the label - his method of booking the studio for months on end in case that was the night he worked. The way Brain decided to record in a temple because it was GNR. Wracking up those kinds of bills puts pressure on the label for the album to have hits - then you get upset when they tell you that you havn't made a pop rock record.
That's the other thing - the label are no doubt tools - but I think Axl's strategy in negotiations is "give me what I want or go fuck yourself for a few years". Look at the way he boycotted the eventual release. Basically I think they have a meeting with the label - and when they're not given limitless marketing money or tour support or whatever then they walk out and do nothing for 2 years until a new offer is on the table.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
Right, but according to Tommy, after "rejecting" the album, they brought in Roy Thomas Baker to re-record the album numerous times. They didn't say, it's not good enough, get better songs. They just had him re-record it ad nauseum to get a better sound. In Tommy's own words that was an enormous waste of time and they received very little help from the label. Maybe they were fed up with Axl and that was their way of fighting back, but if that's the case it just wasted everyone's time. That's not inherently on Axl.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
monkeychow wrote:Don't forget to add the "Axl Tax" which is 2 years to each of those dates
Arguably one of the biggest factors in the delayed release of Chinese Democracy was that the label didn't fully buy into the idea of Axl's rebooted GN'R. Between record company execs getting cold feet and managers continually trying to force a reunion (and band members getting understandably sick of the delays, quitting and needing to be replaced), the process was dragged out unnecessarily over several years.
That's really not going to be an issue with an Axl/Slash/Duff line-up. They could fart into a microphone and the suits would release it in a heartbeat.
Yep.
Axl said CD was finished in 2001 and wanted it released. They wouldn't do it.
Blame the label...not Axl. If Axl had got what he wanted, we'd have had the album 15 years ago and likely the followup a year or two later. We know too much info now that we didn't know back then to blame him for the insane delays.
I also doubt that a GH / Best Of would change their situation with the label. The label owns all of the Chinese Sessions probably in addition to some sort of X albums contract. I remember Prince shitting out albums purely to get around the latter in the 90s.
The main reason to release a GH/Best of is to reintroduce the general public to GNR. Soundgarden did the same thing and I expect it in this situation as well. The GH released 12 years ago is not a great representation of the band....same as with Soundgarden's A Sides released a few years after their breakup. A 2 disc compilation will dive deeper into the band's discography than GH did.
It amazes me when I see people say GNR doesn't warrant a 2 disc compilation.
Great post DtM....
We could very EASILY get at least CD 2 this year. This is all my speculation as is most of this forum but I think its possible.
I have strong doubts we get CD II(or any new album) before we get a GH/Best of. They don't actually need a new album in stores right now anyways. Would we love one? Of course. The timing isn't right. They're reintroducing themselves to the world after a long absence. The world is going down memory lane right now.
Bumblefoot knew Slash was on the way in before the Residency ended, maybe before it started not sure.
While we don't know the full story yet, I think all the members of that CD lineup saw the writing on the wall. That lineup literally had nowhere else to go anyways...it had run out of road.
2. Remember the interview with Fortus in 2014? Here's a link..
http://loudwire.com/guns-n-roses-slash- … to-studio/3. Included in the link above with the interview is a pic that we all remember of Axl tweeting from the studio. Keep in mind its late 2014 when this pic is tweeted...
Yes this is all very interesting in hindsight....especially the statement from Fortus that they were working with Slash riffs. He basically let the cat out of the bag with that statement but fans assumed they were using old Slash riffs from 90s sessions. Obviously that wasn't the case. Slash was already in the band.
So Slash was already in the picture in 2014 or earlier per Bumblefoot.... We know that. We also know that Axl was in the studio in December of 2014, at a time when at least two guitar players are KNOWINGLY LEAVING THE BAND... and yet hes still in the studio. I mean sure there is all kinds of reasons he could be messing around in the studio. But with Fortus even coming out and talking about the new album and a studio pic from Axl, i doubt is was just him tinkering with some old tracks from the early 2000's. Also kind of interesting how it was ONLY Fortus that did an interview that mentioned anything NEW, yea the same guy that is included in this 'reunion' lineup.
Great observation. Yeah, the 2016 lineup was already being assembled as the old lineup was being phased out.
Maybe i'm dreaming but "soon is not the word" has as much meaning to me as "Not in this lifetime"
Agreed. We're getting something but I think its the GH with bonus tracks, not a surprise new album release like The Slip.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
Axl said CD was finished in 2001 and wanted it released. They wouldn't do it.
Blame the label...not Axl. If Axl had got what he wanted, we'd have had the album 15 years ago and likely the followup a year or two later. We know too much info now that we didn't know back then to blame him for the insane delays.
Do you have any backstory/citations on this? I always assumed it was crazy Axl.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
Have you read the Chinese Whispers section of this site? Check 2001....maybe 02.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
The main reason to release a GH/Best of is to reintroduce the general public to GNR. Soundgarden did the same thing and I expect it in this situation as well. The GH released 12 years ago is not a great representation of the band....same as with Soundgarden's A Sides released a few years after their breakup. A 2 disc compilation will dive deeper into the band's discography than GH did.
I agree that there's a need for a VBO, if only to have something to sell during the tour, but I think it's fairly delusional to think anyone will care about a VBO beyond hardcore fans or fans of rock in general. There's no such thing as introducing someone to GNR. GNR is a crazy woman with multiple personality disorder. That and it's 2016. The attention span is not there, the economics of music are in dire straights, and rock's relevancy is at an all-time low.
I can't think of a major act in recent memory who hasn't done a quick or surprise release like Apple. Here's the thing or here's the thing next month after a lead digital single. We have your attention? Good. Go get this thing now. No Machavellian three step plan or anything like that.
The world has changed considerably since 2005, while smart them, those philosophies have gone the way of the dodo.
Another reason they should just release CD2 and then get to today is because CD itself was a mishmash of genres, styles, and musical period influences. They need to get into 2016 / contemporary sound and message if they want to even be close to being relevant again. The longer Axl / the label hoards, the more quickly the world will pass them by. The sooner they release music, the better position they are for the future.
Release 3 EPs each with a relatively cohesive direction (OMG, CD, Riad, Shacklers, Silkworms, Scraped) and keep the momentum going and repeat. Station To Station, Low, Heroes. Man this guy is diverse and brilliant.
I posted this here or in another thread but let's say they do release new music bundled in with a VBO. What do they put on it?
They gain nothing by throwing out some new tracks unless a full album is close by. OMG isn't indicative of CD. Maybe it was supposed to be but putting the burden on 1 song or even 1 album will suffocate GNR like it did the new band. The less they release, the more it's compared to AFD and Jungle. They need death by a thousand cuts and attentive fan-service to do the job, not 1 song that's going to have to change music or other nonsense.
Re: Guns N' Roses tour to continue through 2017(and beyond)
All this talk about Label turning down the album are just rumours and hearsay. There is no concrete evidence to support the claim.
Axl could have easily found a way to release music if he had wanted all these years. He just can`t be bothered anymore despite what he says.
