Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

misterID

monkeychow wrote:

Lets put it another way.
Bumblefoot recorded on those songs in 2006-2007.
Dj Ashba recorded on them in 2009-2011.
Nothing has been released.
In terms of Axl suddenly deciding to empty the vault - why is this different?
I suppose if the theory was that Axl found all guitarists other than slash uninspiring he might have always been waiting until he found that right part...and wasn't able to do it with the previous guitarists....but it seems that lack of guitar ability has never been the problem for nu-GNR.
The issue is the label, the business side, and Axl himself.
Now the label would sure like Slash and Duff on the track...but probably only if they're pumping out hit style songs....but if they're just adding their own take to tracks along the lines of Riad and Scrapped.....I dunno....

This is where I don't think this is fair, by singling out Riad and Scraped, we're really going off the weakest songs of the album (but I still think they're kick ass), like singling out Anything Goes and Think About You as representative of AFD. And a rumor I heard was that the label actually has a good relationship with Axl and wanted to release the album in 2010 but Axl said no, so read into that what you will.

FlashFlood

That was a great point Id and the Anything Goes analogy was spot on.

And what's wrong with Riad? It's a killer rocker and I don't see why people couldn't see Slash playing it.

James

Bri they had to pick someone. I actually agree it was awkward at first seeing him, especially when they released those pics of him in the studio drumming. We were so used to Adler....but I don't know who else they could have picked at the time.

I mean.....could they have waited on Adler? Maybe but time was not on their side. Geffen wanted an album and they needed new material out ASAP. Yes they were the biggest band in the world.....but grunge was right around the corner....they recorded and released those records at the perfect time. UYI and its success helped them survive the onslaught of grunge.

Great post 11day....

One thing, though: this release has to be a best of, not a Greatest Hits II. The back catalogue of GN'R is so limited that trying to put together a second Greatest Hits album will come across as an exercise in barrel-scraping. They need to hook the casual fans with this, and the casual fans want/expect SCOM and November Rain and Civil War.

They're not even close to scraping the bottom of the barrel. Hell...KISS has more hits albums than they do albums and they have almost identical track lists. GNR's GH is NOT a good representation of the band.

Here comes another Soundgarden comparison(close your eyes Chris Piss )

After Soundgarden broke up, the label released a hits album called A Sides.

Here's its track list:
Nothing To Say
Flower
Loud Love
Hands All Over
Get On The Snake
Jesus Christ Pose
Outshined
Rusty Cage
Spoonman
The Day I Tried To Live
Black Hole Sun
Fell On Black Days
Pretty Noose
Burden In My Hand
Blow Up The Outside World
Ty Cobb
Bleed Together

Not a true representation of the band. Does it contain the hits? Sure...but too much killer stuff is missing.

When they reunited....they released Telephantasm....a 2 disc best of that included a new song.

Track list:

CD - Disc One
1. All Your Lies
2. Hunted Down
3. Fopp
4. Beyond The Wheel
5. Flower (BBC Session)*
6. Hands All Over
7. Big Dumb Sex
8. Get On The Snake (Live)
9. Room A Thousand Years Wide (Single Version)*
10. Rusty Cage
11. Outshined
12. Slaves & Bulldozers

CD - Disc Two
1. Jesus Christ Pose (Live)
2. Birth Ritual
3. My Wave
4. Superunknown
5. Spoonman
6. Black Hole Sun
7. Fell On Black Days (Video Version)
8. Burden In My Hand
9. Dusty
10. Pretty Noose (Live on SNL)*
11. Blow Up The Outside World (MTV Live '˜N'™ Loud)*
12. Black Rain*

GNR can do the same thing and even then.....the barrel still hasn't been scraped. There is still material from AFD, Lies, UYI, and TSI sessions to work with and that's not even including the Chinese vault.

The thing that saddens me slightly is that I doubt we'll ever hear the Buckethead/Finck era material now

Me too. The Beavan sessions untouched would be my holy grail. Not just CD II either....CD I as well.

It just wasn't meant to be. Our best hope is years down the road it gets thrown into a box set. I would like to hear it all at least once before I'm dead.

edit:

And what's wrong with Riad?

Nothing. Other than the title track I think its the best song they did musically speaking(minus the Ron solo). 2000-01 band is on fire on that track. If any song shows their true potential, its Riad. It feels like Praxis with Axl as their singer.

apex-twin

misterID wrote:

And a rumor I heard was that the label actually has a good relationship with Axl and wanted to release the album in 2010 but Axl said no, so read into that what you will.

Which would've been a rapid rebuilt from the fallout of 2009. Three points come up.

1. Axl after CD. Can you imagine 15 years of creative work, the fruits of which flushed to a music world that has grown indifferent. To say he was hurt by it is putting it mildly.

2. CD2 in 2010. It was pretty much recorded but sort of in limbo in early 2009. Again, 15 years and a lukewarm reception. Care to go back to the studio to work on the leftovers next week, Ax? Thought so. Also, Azoff. Axl was locked into a legal battle with him - and in 1994, that stuff detached him from making music.

3. Geffen terms. Which could've been condescending from Axl's POV in the vein of 'Given the reception of CD, we have calculated a recoup-this-headache no-thrills approach...'

misterID

apex-twin wrote:

misterID wrote:
And a rumor I heard was that the label actually has a good relationship with Axl and wanted to release the album in 2010 but Axl said no, so read into that what you will.
Which would've been a rapid rebuilt from the fallout of 2009. Three points come up.
1. Axl after CD. Can you imagine 15 years of creative work, the fruits of which flushed to a music world that has grown indifferent. To say he was hurt by it is putting it mildly.
2. CD2 in 2010. It was pretty much recorded but sort of in limbo in early 2009. Again, 15 years and a lukewarm reception. Care to go back to the studio to work on the leftovers next week, Ax? Thought so. Also, Azoff. Axl was locked into a legal battle with him - and in 1994, that stuff detached him from making music.
3. Geffen terms. Which could've been condescending from Axl's POV in the vein of 'Given the reception of CD, we have calculated a recoup-this-headache no-thrills approach...'

Part of that rumor was that they were really going to put some promotion behind it, which is really perplexing. The people who shit the bed with CD are no longer at the label, so the new guys came in with an album that's cost were paid off thanks to Azoff, and Chinese Democracy, which looking at it without all the drama, baggage and ridiculousness, was GEFFEN's biggest seller that year and was actually successful, sustaining the rare feat of a rock album reaching platinum status. There's a reason he said no, and I will always believe that it was mainly because he did not believe in that line up anymore. Specifically, Ron and DJ. at the time I swore he was holding out to get Robin and Bucket back, but perhaps... He was holding out for Slash. Seing the album was coming out in 2016, perhaps the hold out worked.

monkeychow

misterID wrote:

This is where I don't think this is fair, by singling out Riad and Scraped, we're really going off the weakest songs of the album (but I still think they're kick ass),

Actually I really like those 2 songs - I think Riad has some amazing vocals that people ignore because they don't like the industrial flavour of the track. It's really hard to sing well and axl just nails it.

The reason I chose those songs isn't because they're the weakest but because they're amongst the most non-traditional. I don't have the quote at hand but in one of the interviews Axl described how his Chinese Trilogy would become more progressive with each album.

The idea was always that the first record would have the most old-gnr like numbers and the next couple would get more wild. IMO what we got is consistent with that - in that most of CD1 is basically rock stuff just arranged non-rock like except for a couple of tracks. Meanwhile note how Silkworms was withheld.

So i guess my thing is - sure the label wants Slash and Duff - but if Slash and Duff are given industrial stuff like Silkworms - I'm not sure the label will necessarily be into it.

Then again - I guess if the plan is greatest hits + 2 tracks - they could just dig out the most old bandish one - kinda like if CD1 had only been TWAT and TIL I suppose. And who knows - maybe theres also rock tracks in the vault from before Slash left.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the songs wouldn't be good. I'm just sort of thinking of the business case from the labels POV. They'll want to capitalise and do something...I'm just saying they'd want a "There Was A Time" with Slash and Duff not a Shackler's Revenge with Slash and Duff...and we don't know how many of each Axl actually has around.

misterID

Yeah, I see what you're saying, but Axl did say outside being a little meaner, CD II would be like CD. I think the industrial idea was something ten-fifteen years ago, but seeing as the tours went on the band got less and less industrial. Mother Goose complemented the songs but didn't lead them. I think anything moving forward should be more traditional. I just don't see him retrograding the band to be industrial again. Hell, even the 02 line up was guitar driven.

I might be in the minority, but actually I prefer Ray Thomas Bakers work more than Beavens on CD.

FlashFlood

I think they would have veered from "industrial". Goin' Down proves that. It also proved Tommy could fill Izzy's songwriting void.

James

FlashFlood wrote:

I think they would have veered from "industrial"

Yeah that was over the nanosecond after OMG reception. I'm surprised Silkworms was even performed. He probably just wanted to test it out in front of a crowd. HOB version sucks IMO but it sounds pretty bad ass at Rio.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9j3rdnryksg

FlashFlood wrote:

Goin' Down proves that. It also proved Tommy could fill Izzy's songwriting void.

Now that's a bold statement.

Gonna listen to that right now. It was pretty good but I'd like to hear it without Ron(no offense). His stuff just doesn't fit finished tracks recorded eons before he joined.

I still think the song was meant for VGH but held back for a variety of reasons.

polluxlm

James Lofton wrote:

FlashFlood wrote:
I think they would have veered from "industrial"
Yeah that was over the nanosecond after OMG reception. I'm surprised Silkworms was even performed. He probably just wanted to test it out in front of a crowd. HOB version sucks IMO but it sounds pretty bad ass at Rio.

Even as a big fan of Silkworms, those type of songs might fit better for a solo album. Maybe if it was just one song like My World, but a GN'R album needs to be grounded in guitars imo. Something like OMG though is a very nice blend of hard rock and industrial. Love Axl's vocals and lyrics on that one.

FlashFlood wrote:
Goin' Down proves that. It also proved Tommy could fill Izzy's songwriting void.
Now that's a bold statement.
Gonna listen to that right now. It was pretty good but I'd like to hear it without Ron(no offense). His stuff just doesn't fit finished tracks recorded eons before he joined.
I still think the song was meant for VGH but held back for a variety of reasons.

I'd have no problem seeing a song like Going Down on a GN'R album. Reminds me more of a Duff song though. Izzy's songs had a harder edge.

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

Re: Slash and Duff working on CD II according to MSL

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