You are not logged in. Please register or login.
- Topics: Active | Unanswered
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
buzzsaw wrote:Raising taxes doesn't help the middle class. Good jobs help the middle class. Higher paying good jobs. Every other solution does not help the middle class.
Bernie has the luxury of being from Vermont. He never had to fight in an election. He never had to defend or make an important vote with consequences, where his career was on the line. He's never had the responsibility of diplomacy or working across the isle. He's never had to fight. He's never had to deal with real problems. He's had the luxury of being the outsider who could do, vote or say whatever he wanted to the point of calling himself an independent socialist (he was never even a democrat) and his district would vote for him because he's Bernie the mascot. And making college free means shit when so many kids are born at a disadvantage of being poor, with bad school programs and undiagnosed learning problems where they'll never have a real shot at a university, but they will be left paying for privlaged kids to go to a school they could actually afford themselves.
And yet he chose not to jump on the gravy train that Clinton, Pelosi, McConnell, Biden, McCain, and so many others did. Net worth of $500,000 compared to many, many millions for each of those other politicians. They all used their political career for personal enrichment above all else. The corporations have not corrupted him and that is admirable on his part considering the other 99% of politicians in the system. He used his position as a chance to stand up for what he believed in, even while others took the more expedient route on stuff like the Iraq War.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Bernie didn't have to because he never really had to campaign. He didnt need the money. But he is beholden to his donors who are ultra left winggers. Money is protected as free speech. You're never going to get it out of politics. I'm more concerned over redistricting than money.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Bernie didn't have to because he never really had to campaign. He didnt need the money. But he is beholden to his donors who are ultra left winggers. Money is protected as free speech. You're never going to get it out of politics. I'm more concerned over redistricting than money.
Mostly left wing, but I don't think they are all left wing. His donation page on OpenSecrets.org looks a lot cleaner than any other candidate. Over 70% of the donations are "small" (which I think is under $200). Remaining donations are between $200 and $2,700. He claims 3 million donors at $27 each. That is not an example of corporations and individual billionaires buying power. He doesn't have a Super-Pac, so there is no George Soros writing a $8m check to him like Clinton or the numerous billionaires writing enormous checks to Cruz, Bush, Rubio, etc.
A number of people are supporting him because they see his record of integrity, which is extremely rare in our political system regardless of your political leaning. Everyone is fucking tired of the status quo. There are libertarians and even Republicans jumping on the Sanders bandwagon.
I'm in the oil industry and hope like hell the GOP wins just as a way to make sure my industry is left alone, but I admire Sanders' stance on corruption in the political system. I just strongly dislike his radical environmentalist agenda. Hillary also very bad on this topic.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
He lost me at single payer. There's zero chance the gov't won't fuck up health care. Zero. I don't care who is in office. Insurance companies aren't the issue. They just get blamed because that's the easy way to do it. Until costs get controlled there's nothing anybody can do to fix health care.
We should also move to performance based pay for physicians instead of volume based pay. Why do we have to pay for them to keep trying to fix the same thing over and over instead of paying when they actually fix it? There are so many things wrong with health care beyond insurance companies.
Seniors love Medicare so don't be so certain the government would screw it up. A single payer system would help control costs because the government can negotiate prices.
- Mama's Good Boy
- Rep: 25
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Single Payer would fix our healthcare system IMO.
Obamacare as a self employed individual making a decent middle class living SUCKS.
This is for a family of 3 keep in mind.
My options are basically a $500 month premium (somewhat affordable) with a $13,000 yearly deductable (are you out of your fucking mind?!) or a $1000 a month premium (too steep for my budget) with a $2,000 yearly deductable. And i make too much to get any kind of subsidy or tax credit.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Raising taxes doesn't help the middle class. Good jobs help the middle class. Higher paying good jobs. Every other solution does not help the middle class.
People have a heart attack at the words "raise" and "taxes" put together, but you have to look at the bigger picture. Bernie's plan would raise taxes some, but it would eliminate insurance premiums and deductibles which would result in a net savings for the middle class. How does that not help the middle class?
Look at other countries with a single payer system. It hasn't hurt their middle class. The U.S. has higher poverty levels than any other wealth nation.
Bernie also has a plan to create 13 million jobs by rebuilding America's crumbling infrastructure. He also wants to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour. Both help the middle and lower classes.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
buzzsaw wrote:Raising taxes doesn't help the middle class. Good jobs help the middle class. Higher paying good jobs. Every other solution does not help the middle class.
Bernie has the luxury of being from Vermont. He never had to fight in an election. He never had to defend or make an important vote with consequences, where his career was on the line. He's never had the responsibility of diplomacy or working across the isle. He's never had to fight. He's never had to deal with real problems. He's had the luxury of being the outsider who could do, vote or say whatever he wanted to the point of calling himself an independent socialist (he was never even a democrat) and his district would vote for him because he's Bernie the mascot. And making college free means shit when so many kids are born at a disadvantage of being poor, with bad school programs and undiagnosed learning problems where they'll never have a real shot at a university, but they will be left paying for privlaged kids to go to a school they could actually afford themselves.
It's kinda messed up to assume poor kids don't have a shot at University. You're also overlooking the middle class children that are saddled with crushing debt because they have to take out tens of thousands of dollars in loans (or 100,000+ if they want to go to grad school). Free college would save middle class youth a ton of money which would go back into the economy as they could afford to purchase homes and cars. That's the other part of Bernie's platform that gets overlooked. The money saved from the "free stuff" would get pumped back into the economy (because let's face it we're a nation of consumers) and would create more jobs. Millions of young people would benefit from free college which would outweigh the privileged few who could afford it outright.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Correct Buzz, we are a huge vast country. What works in Europe will not always work here. Just like what works here will not work in Iraq or Syria.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Single payer is not the answer. I've yet to hear of a country anywhere near our size with socialized health care that likes it.
Insurance gets more efficient, and effective as the number of insured goes up. You should be able to run one of the most effective single-payer healthcare systems in the world.
