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Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
The free market and capitalism made the US the most powerful economy the world has ever seen. Socialist ideas bankrupt Greece. The more we act like Greece the better the odds we fail like them.
The rest of your post is thoughtful enough, although I don't agree with some of the statements I would with others. This here though, is plain nonsense. Greece failed because of corruption within the government, not because of an ideology. Greece failed because of pandering by the government to special interest groups, which is exactly the same reason why America pushed the world into a deep recession in 2008. No 'system' is going to hold up under a deeply corrupt government, from communism over socialism to capitalism and anything in between.
If we are going to give free health care use the European model. Obama Care is horrible. I now pay over $300 per month for an individual policy and I am very healthy. People can't afford this shit.
Agreed, and that is exactly what Bernie is proposing.
US colleges have been fucking over students for a while, but I don't trust the government to give us just as good of a product for free. Won't work. And we can't just tax our way out of everything.
It's unlikely that public colleges will ever be able to compete with private ivy league style schools. When socialist countries talk about helping people out, it is by providing the bare minimum, the basics. A public college education beats the hell out of no higher education, and wouldn't be a drop in the bucket that is the overall budget.
We need to LOWER taxes on the middle class
Although I'm all in favor of lowering income taxes, what you actually NEED is to increase the buying power, which can be achieved by other means as well. Such as abolishing student debt and super-expensive private healthcare.
and corporations and try to get companies back in the US and out of Mexico and China.
That's a matter of trade policies, not taxation.
I think Wall Street is so fucking corrupt and when you can bet on people to fail it creates a cluster fuck of motives and incentives. Shorts, calls, etc can't be good. A lot of people made BILLIONS betting on the housing market to fail. Watch the Big Short. It seems a little unethical to me. Also the market was way up and now it's back down again. It is not a good reflection of the actual market.
I agree with all of this, so we both seem to be saying we need more regulation on Wall Street. As long as the big banks can buy out politicians, nothing will change though. Sounds like you need to vote for Bernie...
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Bernie says some things I like, no doubt. But he also would not be opposed to a 90% tax on the rich.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Smoking Guns wrote:The free market and capitalism made the US the most powerful economy the world has ever seen. Socialist ideas bankrupt Greece. The more we act like Greece the better the odds we fail like them.
I like free shit, but if you study economics you see free shit quality goes down vs private non govt regulated stuff.
If we are going to give free health care use the European model. Obama Care is horrible. I now pay over $300 per month for an individual policy and I am very healthy. People can't afford this shit.
He US is a huge country with 300,000,000 + people. So what works for Sweden may not be the best solution for the US.
US colleges have been fucking over students for a while, but I don't trust the government to give us just as good of a product for free. Won't work. And we can't just tax our way out of everything.
We need to LOWER taxes on the middle class and corporations and try to get companies back in the US and out of Mexico and China.
This is way too complex for simple answers on a message board, but being an economics guy I believe outside of national defense typically the government makes the issue worse not better. I believe in free markets (with regulation) but not too much regulation.
I think Wall Street is so fucking corrupt and when you can bet on people to fail it creates a cluster fuck of motives and incentives. Shorts, calls, etc can't be good. A lot of people made BILLIONS betting on the housing market to fail. Watch the Big Short. It seems a little unethical to me. Also the market was way up and now it's back down again. It is not a good reflection of the actual market.
Defense have literally spent over a trillion dollars on fighter jets they knew can't fly during a storm. That's corrupt.
Government spending and research also created the internet and sattelite technologies, everything that led us to economic booms and changed the free market. The military is now investing in clean energy because oil is not sustainable and was a disadvantage during the wars.
Wall street is as corrupt as the corporations who get the biggest tax breaks and even pay no taxes, who STILL offshore jobs. I don't know how much lower you want their taxes to be. The tax code is loaded with loopholes so they pay very little taxes. How has that ever helped? How about they get those tax cuts when they stasyin the US?
Your healthcare is more because we're the only country in the free world who does not cap the medical and pharmecutical industries, or class action lawsuits. Until that is fixed nothing will help.
And stop about socialism, its a scare tactic, it will never come to pass. Even majority of democrats are anti socialism.
ID, yes, corporate tax break are only for those that keep or bring jobs back to the US.
We try free trade with countries like China that makes things not a level playing field. Trump is correct in that aspect.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
I liked what Bernie said about big pharma and wall street last night. And to be fair, he wants a 55% on the wealthy, which will inevitably lead to the middle class also, and that's unacceptable.
Yep... 55% now, but he is only saying that not to freak people out. He would be fine with a much higher rate.... Clinton is a far superior candidate but nobody likes her.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
Rand Paul is pretty damn smart... Hard to argue with him when you put it that way. Of course we want "free" health care... But that really means 53% of the country pay for health care for 100% of the country I guess. That free health care is paid by the tax payers. I think only about 53%, misterID correct that number please, pays taxes. So it is just more taxes in the form of insurance premiums to cover the uninsured and IT STILL LEAVES OUT 30,000,000 people.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
I guess just call it another tax and do the European model. I don't think it is a "right" but I think there is a way to make health care much more affordable. How about tax breaks for those that maintain good health, don't smoke, aren't obese etc, so that people have financial incentive to be healthier too? America eats like shit which is why we are less healthy than our European friends.
Re: 2016 Presidential Election Thread
It's funny, you guys argue as if politicians still run the country--or the world. They don't. Corporations and billionaires do.
Why hasn't there been a "cure" for cancer or AIDS yet? Because there's more money in never-ending treatment, surgeries, screenings and checkups than curing it with one shot. Same with AIDs.
Why isn't there a real commitment to alternative fuel? The oil industry would not accept that, lobbies against it.
Why do we have never-ending war? So defense contractors and the military industrial complex can continue to make billions. Now they are militarizing the police to make even more.
Why will marijuana be legal within 5 years? Too much money to be had for tobacco companies, who will get into the marijuana cigarette business. Tobacco companies also have prevented smoking from being banned, along with big pharmaceutical.
Why do billionaires and corporations have so many tax breaks and tax loopholes? Because they have lawmakers in their pocket.
It's a losing fight for common folks like us. All politicians know this. Only Bernie dares mention it, which is why he'll never win. He couldn't do anything about it if he even did become president.
