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Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
Since my satellite went out because of a storm the other night, I put in my old Tokyo DVDs just for the hell of it. This comparison is really based on the band at that moment, not quality-wise... and I refuse to call Vegas "Appetite For Democracy." Not only is that a stupid name, but it's also tacky.
First, the band:
Matt vs Frank = FRANK and it's not even close. Matt was a great technician, but I've heard the term stiff and I agree with it. Even though Steven was nowhere as talented, he had a groove, and you could feel it. Matt was very cold, like a machine. Frank is both a technician and has a groove. I'll say Frank is the best drummer GN'R has had. And I love Brain.
Gilby vs Richard = RICHARD, Gilby hits the right notes, he's good, but he didn't fit the band... Matter of fact, I think both Gilby and Matt hindered the sound of those shows. Slash and Duff fit. These guys felt like session musicians. And Gilby's twang style was irritating. I'll give Gilby this... I do love Wild Horses. But Richard has blown me away recently. And most of all, and what tips the scales, is that the current line up gels perfectly with each other. It's very very smooth and these guys fit. Richard slips in and out of lead and rhythm seamlessly. And his style doesn't overpower the song...
Slash vs DJ = SLASH. This is harder between Ron because he plays these songs perfectly, and hits a really smooth stride, whereas Slash was fucking sloppy and hit or miss from moment to moment... but when he was on in that show he blew DJ off the stage. I'll leave Ron out of it, because of the styles, but comparing Estranged... Ron owns that song and feels it, Slash is punching a time card... and it shows. DJ on the other hand... He tries too hard to be what Slash is naturally. Slash didn't pander to the crowd. There were no generic and choreographed poses and moves... Slash shows up, does the gig, and runs around a bit. And DJ tries too hard to put his own stamp on songs (like the Steve Stevenson shit) whereas he works better just playing the song. The word phoney keeps springing to mind with DJ and that's probably not fair. He's good at what he does, but if there's a weak link in the band, it's DJ. He's the Gilby of the new band.
Duff vs Tommy = Not really fair. Duff is sloppy as hell, but is more vital to the songs because he has to be the driving force next to Slash... and to pick up the weight of Izzy's shadow. Tommy is cool, he has that groove, but he's happily part of the machine of the band and not a show stealer. Duff has more of a presence... but it's closer to a tie if Tommy sang Sonic Reducer.
Axl 92 vs Axl 14 = Now this is interesting... The power and the spite is with Axl 92, but at the same time, it's a guy putting on a show, letting lose when it calls for it. 14 Axl is pushing himself to hit those screams and notes. You can also hear the damage in those vocal chords in 92... A funny thing, my niece watched it, and couldn't understand what was wrong with Axl in 1992. She didn't get SCOM and Civil War at all and let me know she thought it was awful. To put this into context, her favorite GNR songs are Better and This I love... She has no connection to the old band outside November Rain... I just thought it was interesting hearing someone who is used to THIS Axl compared to the old one. She knew there was more power, but said he's trying to sing now... "Trying" was the word that got me. In 1992 November Rain was perfection... Now, it's a staple in the show and it doesn't have that feeling behind it anymore. Jungle is better now because Axl is proving himself, instead just throwing that one out as part of the show... And you can hear that feeling in the new songs. But it's hard not to be moved by 92 Axl's Nightrain vocals. He set out to prove something on that song. Much like Axl does Jungle now. I think it's a tie. The high-pitched falsetto vs the harsh, damaged shriek... They both have their ups and downs... And they both play the showman... but when they're on, they are on. I call it a tie.
The current band wins as a unit. But the interesting thing is, the camaraderie between band members is almost identical
- Me_Wise_Magic
- Rep: 70
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
I love Frank's playing style. I agree he is the best drummer GNR have had in any incarnation. I hope he gets to do all the drum tracks and fills on a new album in the future. He's got the right rhythm and feel to the Appetite, UYI, covers, and CD material. ..And I really like Brain too especially some of his moments on CD, Rio 2001, and some of the 2006 shows he is quite the force.
Both Duff and Tommy kick so much ass; but I got to give a little more edge to Duff. Slash beats DJ that's no question even on Slash's bad nights in the past. Still like DJ for the most part; but I could call him the weak link in the band in some ways. Bucket and Ron though...hmm...Those guys have some tough chops.
Richard blows Gilby out of the water with this shredding and balance!
Axl is Axl...I suppose.
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
- metallex78
- Rep: 194
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
Really? The 1992 band is THE fucking legendary (mostly) original lineup, in all their gloriously sloppy brilliance.
The new band is tight, I'll give them that. But they may as well be a bunch of session musos.
Being tight is never what Gn'R were about to me. And yes, I sound like a complete hypocrite because I keep praising Slash and his band for being so tight these days... 
But GN'R were the perfect combination of it almost falling apart, only to turn around and be fucking amazingly epic, usually within the one song! 
- FlashFlood
- Rep: 55
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
In general I always thought the Tokyo show was crap. At least the videos they put out, anyway. Axl generally sounds horrible, the crowd has no life, and the setlist blows. The Sorum solo is absolutely nauseating.
Having said that, it's difficult to really compare the eras. Just so different.
Of course, the best recorded GNR show is and will always be the Ritz. THAT is what the band was all about.
From the Chinese Era? My single favorite performance is WTTJ at Rio 3. I get chills watching Axl making his grand re-debut and the crowd going absolutely bananas.
- A Private Eye
- Rep: 77
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
I personally think the Tokyo dvds are poor, nobody could touch GNR from that period when they were on, I just don't think they were 'on' that night. So many classic shows that could have been used for the dvd from that era, it's a crime the only official pro shot we have is from that show. Not seen the vegas show yet so I can't compare but as a show it wouldnt be hard to top Tokyo, lineup wise give me 92 all day long but show for show Vegas 12 could easily be superior.
For me the best new lineup show is Rock Am Ring 06, first time they really looked like a band rather than assembled musicians. Axl sounded killer as well but more than that he really fucking WANTED it, thuere was a hunger in 06 that wasn't there in 01/02 and we haven't seen very much since IMO. In fact I'd go so far as to say Rock Am Ring is one of the great GNR shows of any era.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
I guess I won't surprise anyone, but it's not even close. Tokyo is the true essential of what GN'R were in their prime. I always liked this show (I heard it as a bootleg first, long before the dvds came out) and didn't understand why others don't. The best DTJ ever would win against any Nu-band show for me. (Side note: I didn' really like Estranged for months, and this show made me an ultimate fan of the song.)
I only saw those 3 songs off the Vegas dvd they uploaded and I did't like those. Not talking about Axl's poor to horrible performances, since this thread is about the band. But they don't play the songs they way it needs to be done. Guns N' Roses were an alive, sleazy spontaneous (sometimes sloppy...) rock band. They really played, if you know what I mean. It wasn't an over-directed performance - they played and this made the music alive. Slash always searched for The Fountain of Music (I know I'm getting psychedelic) and more often than not he found it. The old band, even with Gilby and Matt was more of a medium that let music flow through them, while the new band is made of professional session players, who deliver the notes (more often than not, sans DJ Ashba), but they only perform the songs and not live the songs.
That's the difference for me.
- FlashFlood
- Rep: 55
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
So you feel that way about Gilby and Matt's playing? They are "living" it and not just playing what's called for?
I guess what I don't get is how you can call it the band's prime, or essential gnr, when you're missing two key members. That's why The Ritz does it for me 
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Tokyo '92 vs Vegas '14
So you feel that way about Gilby and Matt's playing? They are "living" it and not just playing what's called for?
I guess what I don't get is how you can call it the band's prime, or essential gnr, when you're missing two key members. That's why The Ritz does it for me
Well, I LOVED the energy of the original GN'R. But Steven and Izzy were weak links live. The band was still amazing, no matter how drugged up and boozed they were, or how little they knew about music back then. I love that sincere, explosive approach. But I also love the more musical approach of the UYI era live band.
Yes, I think both Gilby and Matt lived those songs - more important the band as a whole lived them. Of course it was more of an Axl N' Slash N' (to a lesser extent) Duff driven force, while the original band was a real band. To tell the truth I can't and don't wanna choose between those live periods - I love both.
