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- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
The writing process to me is very cut and paste.
The demo catcher solo was assembled by Axl out of outtakes. Then Ron's version is a cover of the major theme's of the Axl-May version with a healthy amount of Ron-goodness mixed in.
IRS's song structure evolved to have two solos. The first solo used to be the second solo...before bucket wrote a better solo to go over the scream bit.
Other songs really sound like they include several different ideas joined together...like better.....and Axl says a lot that he has a lot of unfinished song ideas as well as completed songs.
But as for Ron...
I feel we don't really know enough about the workings of the band to really say for sure though.
Can Ron just call up the others or do they need to be paid for their time? What is the etiquette on holding a GNR writing session sans Axl? If the others all wrote and liked a song idea and Axl didn't - would he mind them all releasing it under another name without his involvement? (He doesn't mind things like Ron's Pink Panther single...but where's the line - can they do a whole album of everyone in GNR except Axl?) Is it better manners to send song ideas to Axl first? Do you invite Axl to come to your song writing session? How long do you wait to write with richard after sending your initial idea to Axl?
If the band was productive I'd tell him to shut up too. But hey...as frustrating as it is for us....must be so much worse to be in the band and be waiting to do something kickass that you KNOW you can do...but "life gets in the way" - ie there's always some reason the band doesn't do it. I don't see it as him being passive agressive, I see it more as frustration at being asked about new material in interviews, that's why he's now telling us to forget it!, along with maybe a little bit of desperation that he just doesn't understand on some level what the problem is.
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
What is the etiquette on holding a GNR writing session sans Axl? If the others all wrote and liked a song idea and Axl didn't - would he mind them all releasing it under another name without his involvement?
The precedent to this scenario is called It's Five O'clock Somewhere.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
Sure is....and Axl doesn't seem to have forgiven Slash for it to this day.
Go ahead bumble...release a record of the guitar tracks Axl rejects.....dare ya 
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
The difference between cutting and pasting with writing and production: At some point, someone brought IRS in its conception to Axl. Robin brought Better to Axl in it's conception. Those guys came up with the idea and brought it to Axl. Catcher and IRS were restructured in production after it was brought to Axl. That's what I'm saying.
Even though it seems I'm not getting my point across in any way shape or form here 
I still think that instead of standing on the sidelines, saying the same thing for five years, knowing it's not going to happen the way you're wanting but you continue to complain about it, just start writing. Not impossible. Not hard. And it won't hurt anybody. Not unless he wants to be paid to do it, and that's a whole other discussion.
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
Sure is....and Axl doesn't seem to have forgiven Slash for it to this day.
And it appears to be one particular sore point in their relationship, as in, Axl appears to think that he was busy reinventing GNR, and while he claims he wanted to hone IFOCS further, he dismisses the released album as a bit half-baked, to put it mildly. Based on what Axl and Slash have both said about the era, I think Ax got a bit jealous over the fact that while his own solo album floundered, Slash pulled his one off on his own - without ever intending to do a solo album in the first place. Not only that, but Axl apparently felt that having tasted the supposed glories of autonomy, the Slash that came back wasn't as ready for the reinvention of GNR as Axl would've wanted / hoped / expected. In other words, Slash "turned his back" on Axl (with IFOCS) and "betrayed" him (in the later Paul Tobias sessions).
I'm not Axl, and I wasn't there, but that's the general idea I get from the IFOCS era. 
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
monkeychow wrote:Sure is....and Axl doesn't seem to have forgiven Slash for it to this day.
And it appears to be one particular sore point in their relationship, as in, Axl appears to think that he was busy reinventing GNR, and while he claims he wanted to hone IFOCS further, he dismisses the released album as a bit half-baked, to put it mildly. Based on what Axl and Slash have both said about the era, I think Ax got a bit jealous over the fact that while his own solo album floundered, Slash pulled his one off on his own - without ever intending to do a solo album in the first place. Not only that, but Axl apparently felt that having tasted the supposed glories of autonomy, the Slash that came back wasn't as ready for the reinvention of GNR as Axl would've wanted / hoped / expected. In other words, Slash "turned his back" on Axl (with IFOCS) and "betrayed" him (in the later Paul Tobias sessions).
I'm not Axl, and I wasn't there, but that's the general idea I get from the IFOCS era.
From Axl's viewpoint, maybe. But I think his perception of things that happened then became much worse later. Intercourse's Axl quote from 1992-1993 proves that.
Anyway, Tommy's solo album was made of Axl rejects, too, so there is a way to release the music you wrote. Perhaps depends on Axl's mood and your relationship, the amount of music he has... or whether his NFL team lost or won right then. More likely what the Malibu Mafia and his Yodas whisper to his ears.
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
I still don't think it takes Axl for this BAND to write. Why can't DJ, Ron, Rich, Tommy, Frank, Dizzy & Chris get together as a band and write THEMSELVES? Why are they relying on Axl? Axl has relied on this format since the earlier days of GN'R in the mid-80s. THE BAND writes, and Axl spit shines it and brings it together.
They all don't even have to work imo. DJ, Ron & Rich can write together. Tommy can do solo jams with GN'R in mind. Dizzy & Chris can come up with melodies and keyboard synth, and Frank can 'fill' in when needed. Boom, you have underlying instrumentals for the next album. Take it to Axl, and see what he thinks.
Why is it Axl's problem what THEY do as a band? Axl's not holding "a Gun" pardon the expression to their heads and saying "you can't write anything with GN'R in mind without me".
They've already kinda done it, unless Axl hated it. DJ's Ballad of Death (which I think is awesome), DJ's Mi Amor (which is not that great, but an okay B-side), Tommy collaborating with Rich & Dizzy on "One Man Mutiny" which I consider the closest to a GN'R song we've gotten since CD, and the feel of the song has a real GN'R Lies appeal. Dizzy & Chris were supposed to be collaborating, but we never heard any of it, and according to DJ, Axl still breaks out the piano when at home and works, so umm....
What the hell man? Where's the fuckin' music at? There's no way 7-8 guys are all conspiring together to lie to everyone on seperate occasions. I think they have written bits n' pieces and Axl didn't give a shit is the problem.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
It seems like a catch 22 to me.
Axl's said he doesn't like finished songs being dumped on him, and of the group, he's probably the most likely to want to take the song on a wild ride in terms of radically altering (improving) parts of it or otherwise changing it up. As both the lead vocalist and , indeed, the owner of the band his opinion on the direction a song goes is fundamentally more important than anyone elses.
So they can't really do it for real without him, short of developing new solo sections or jams. But they also can't require his presence or overstep their boundaries in terms of pushing him to come play with them / running his own band without him.
So it leaves them in limbo, can't take charge, have to keep waiting for something that doesn't happen.
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
Well in that theory, it truely is ALL Axl's fault. He doesn't like finished songs being dumped on him, but he's also been interviewed and basically alluded to wanting more "initiative" out of other writers to carry his load, so it's not all him.
He can't have it both ways.
Re: Ron says 'Just Forget About A New Record Until It Happens'
Well in that theory, it truely is ALL Axl's fault. He doesn't like finished songs being dumped on him, but he's also been interviewed and basically alluded to wanting more "initiative" out of other writers to carry his load, so it's not all him.
He can't have it both ways.
He's had it both ways for the past 15 years.
