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Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
faldor wrote:[Also, you could argue that CD does have something to do with GNR getting in. That album became mythical. It took so long to come out, it was a major topic of conversation in the music world for a decade. You could argue if GNR had gone into hiding in 1994 and no one ever heard anything again from them, the Hall could've passed on them. The CD era, at the very least, kept them relevant. To what extent, can certainly be debated. It's not exactly a blip on the radar screen however. You can complain about record sales or quality all you want. The album got great reviews and a whole lot of attention initially. They've been touring the album in every corner of the world for nearly 3 years now. Again, all things that have kept the GNR name out there, for what it's worth.
I don't believe you could not argue that in the slightest. CD era did not keep them relevant in anyway whatsoever and with or without CD the band was going in as a 1st ballot inductee. Let's not misconstrue some peopel being aware that Axl is touring and released and album with Gn'R being relevant. The classic hits were not getting airplay based on CD's mythology and people attendeding tours in 2000-2007 were not attending them to hear CD era songs. Ok maybe a sprinkling of fans but c'mon. CD played no part in Gn'R's relevance in terms of public perception other than to fuel the idea that Gn'R sucks without Slash. Not something I'm saying but something that is the general consensus among the average Joe in my opinion.
Slash's activity with solo albums, guest spots and the existence of Velvet Revolver played a much bigger role in keeping the Gn'R name relevant in my opinion.
I think you missed my point, or maybe I didn't explain it well enough. I'm not saying CD helped them get into the Hall because of its greatness. I'm saying since there WAS a Chinese Democracy, there was reason for Axl to go on with the band, albeit without any original members. Therefore GNR didn't seize to exist in 1994.
And I'll agree, Slash becoming one of the most recognized guitarists, and VR helped keep the GNR memories alive as well.
You might be right, they may have gotten in just based off of their 6 year span even without anything that followed. But I do think each member remaining active in an assortment of ways helped a bit.
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Eddie Trunk has been tweeting about the Rock Hall ever since the inductees were announced. Apparently he's having the CEO of the Hall on his satellite radio show in a couple weeks so he can yell at them about what bands aren't in. I'm sure GNR will be discussed as well.
Also, I was listening to Wednesday's Howard Stern Show today and they talked briefly about the Hall. Howard fully agreed with GNR's induction, and he went on to talk about Bob Lefsetz's latest blog on the subject and how he thinks this could spark a GNR reunion.
Can't say I agree with Lefsetz on that one, but here it is anyway.
Handicapping The Rock & Roll Hall Of Fame
Well, maybe it’s the nominating committee that’s handicapped, but I’m gonna give you my take, followed by who I want in and who I believe will get in.
1. Guns ‘N Roses
Don’t overthink this, don’t worry about this being their first year of eligibility. If GNR doesn’t get in on the first ballot we should occupy Cleveland and demand they shut the Hall down. GNR made one of the greatest debuts of all time, one of the two best hard rock records ever (the other being "Back In Black"), and although the "Illusions" were overbaked, they still stood heads and heels above almost all of the dreck out there.
As for Axl being insane… The good thing is nobody can have a vendetta against him, we don’t hold grudges against the mentally ill.
I don’t think their induction, which will happen, will bring the original group back together to record and tour, but that’s gonna happen too, because they’re giving away tickets to Axl’s version of the act all over North America and this guy goes through money like a kid goes through Pez and financial ruin will do what no amount of Azoff cajoling could make happen, which is bring the original band back together.
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Your buttons are pretty easy to press, Bono. You just have to disagree with you. 
And I wasn't lecturing you on your point, I understand what you're saying, that certain people looking at the line up of TSI? then seeing the line up at Rio in 2001 would be like seeing two different bands. Yes, you're right. But that's not what I'm arguing. You keep saying this:
The band was basically wiped clean after TSI but if it helps you sleep at night to recognize it as a gradual trend and the evolution from the Illusion era to the CD era was natural then ok. Fact is the rest of the world looks at it as a major house cleaning. Basically two completely different bands in the "blink of an eye"
See, you're talking like it's fact, and basing it on perception. That's what my "lecture" in the time line of GN'R was about. Not that what you're saying is really wrong, and that this stems from who should be inducted into the HOF, which I wasn't disagreeing with you. You're trying to trump reality with perception, BUT...
Fans who really actually cared about the original line up, who this argument even matters anything to, will know the deal and that the trend started with Steven, then Izzy leaving and being replaced. Then Slash quitting.
But the people YOU'RE talking about, average joe and Jane Public, you know "the entire world" exaggeration (I'm sure you'll quote a few of your friends here as proof of your theory as representing the entire world here), who had the 7 year "blink of an eye" (which technically would be a coma) when the new line up emerged at RIO probably only noticed that Slash wasn't in the band anymore. That was the big shock. Not that it was a new band.
And I guarantee you the vast majority of people you're talking about could only name 2 members of the original band. Axl and Slash.
CD was absolutely a natural progression from the old line up to CD. GN'R never ceased to exist, as Flador said, it carried on to what we have today.
I have principles yes and if it were up to me and I had final say and Axl said "I don't show unless the new guys get inducted" then I would say thanks for your input Axl but the new guys are not getting in. I have no say in the matter however and I'm watching it either way. Doesnt' make my principles any less strong.
WEAK!!! 
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Your buttons are pretty easy to press, Bono. You just have to disagree with you.
And I wasn't lecturing you on your point, I understand what you're saying, that certain people looking at the line up of TSI? then seeing the line up at Rio in 2001 would be like seeing two different bands. Yes, you're right. But that's not what I'm arguing. You keep saying this:
Bono wrote:The band was basically wiped clean after TSI but if it helps you sleep at night to recognize it as a gradual trend and the evolution from the Illusion era to the CD era was natural then ok. Fact is the rest of the world looks at it as a major house cleaning. Basically two completely different bands in the "blink of an eye"
See, you're talking like it's fact, and basing it on perception. That's what my "lecture" in the time line of GN'R was about. Not that what you're saying is really wrong, and that this stems from who should be inducted into the HOF, which I wasn't disagreeing with you. You're trying to trump reality with perception, BUT...
Fans who really actually cared about the original line up, who this argument even matters anything to, will know the deal and that the trend started with Steven, then Izzy leaving and being replaced. Then Slash quitting.
But the people YOU'RE talking about, average joe and Jane Public, you know "the entire world" exaggeration (I'm sure you'll quote a few of your friends here as proof of your theory as representing the entire world here), who had the 7 year "blink of an eye" (which technically would be a coma) when the new line up emerged at RIO probably only noticed that Slash wasn't in the band anymore. That was the big shock. Not that it was a new band.
And I guarantee you the vast majority of people you're talking about could only name 2 members of the original band. Axl and Slash.
CD was absolutely a natural progression from the old line up to CD. GN'R never ceased to exist, as Flador said, it carried on to what we have today.
See you know exactly what my point was yet you continued to say I was wrong and felt the need to go over the history of the depature of each member as though I was ignornat to it all. Perception is reality MisterID and the perception is Guns N' Roses was Guns N' Roses and then Axl took over the band and replaced every single member that most people on this planet, my friends included, percieved as Guns N' Roses. Deal with it. The world looks at Gn'R as Axl and a bunch of new guys. Not just Axl minus Slash. Axl and a bunch of new guys.
And I guarantee you the vast majority of people you're talking about could only name 2 members of the original band. Axl and Slash.
And I guarantee you the overwhelmingly vast majority of the people I'm talking about couldn't name anyone other than Axl in the new band and probably couldn't name you one single song off CD other than maybe Chinese Democracy itself. But hey if they were to get inducted into the HOF it's all good, they woked hard for it.
And in this case the time frame in which all the members chose to leave does dictate who should be inducted because nothing of significance happend after 1993 as ffara s the RRHOF is concerned. And that's the way it is.
Bono wrote:I have principles yes and if it were up to me and I had final say and Axl said "I don't show unless the new guys get inducted" then I would say thanks for your input Axl but the new guys are not getting in. I have no say in the matter however and I'm watching it either way. Doesnt' make my principles any less strong.
WEAK!!!
No it's not fucking weak. You're suggesting I simply not be interested in Guns N' Roses because someone else made a decision I had no say in concerning the band. It's not weak at all.
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Bono wrote:faldor wrote:[Also, you could argue that CD does have something to do with GNR getting in. That album became mythical. It took so long to come out, it was a major topic of conversation in the music world for a decade. You could argue if GNR had gone into hiding in 1994 and no one ever heard anything again from them, the Hall could've passed on them. The CD era, at the very least, kept them relevant. To what extent, can certainly be debated. It's not exactly a blip on the radar screen however. You can complain about record sales or quality all you want. The album got great reviews and a whole lot of attention initially. They've been touring the album in every corner of the world for nearly 3 years now. Again, all things that have kept the GNR name out there, for what it's worth.
I don't believe you could not argue that in the slightest. CD era did not keep them relevant in anyway whatsoever and with or without CD the band was going in as a 1st ballot inductee. Let's not misconstrue some peopel being aware that Axl is touring and released and album with Gn'R being relevant. The classic hits were not getting airplay based on CD's mythology and people attendeding tours in 2000-2007 were not attending them to hear CD era songs. Ok maybe a sprinkling of fans but c'mon. CD played no part in Gn'R's relevance in terms of public perception other than to fuel the idea that Gn'R sucks without Slash. Not something I'm saying but something that is the general consensus among the average Joe in my opinion.
Slash's activity with solo albums, guest spots and the existence of Velvet Revolver played a much bigger role in keeping the Gn'R name relevant in my opinion.
I think you missed my point, or maybe I didn't explain it well enough. I'm not saying CD helped them get into the Hall because of its greatness. I'm saying since there WAS a Chinese Democracy, there was reason for Axl to go on with the band, albeit without any original members. Therefore GNR didn't seize to exist in 1994.
And I'll agree, Slash becoming one of the most recognized guitarists, and VR helped keep the GNR memories alive as well.
You might be right, they may have gotten in just based off of their 6 year span even without anything that followed. But I do think each member remaining active in an assortment of ways helped a bit.
From my point of view, I've been a die hard GNR fan all my life and seen the ups and downs in popularity, and in the UK GNR pretty much disapeared from the public consciousness till about 2004 when greatest hits came out. Then all of a sudden GNR were cool again, getting airplay on the radio and spoken about in the media.
From the mid 90's till about 2004 I used to collect every article I ever came across, record every mention on TV - and they were few and far between, thats why I collected them, it was my favourite band and I got a kick out of seeing mentions of them.
But Greatest Hits changed that, and I firmly believe the successful 2006 Euro tour would have sold as badly as the abandoned 2001 Euro Tour if it wasnt for that albums success.
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Dude, the people who saw the original GN'R as Axl and Slash are the same people who see GN'R today as Axl and a bunch of other guys. And their opinions don't mean shit, imho. 
Perception is reality? THAT MAKES NO SENSE!!!
That's like a guy driving around in a mercedes Benz, wearing nice clothes, and everyone thinks he's a millionaire, when in fact he's broke, he's wearing his brothers clothes and driving his mom's car. It's not real.
We both know the reality, bono. That's what matters. No uninformed persons "perception" has anything to do with what the real, honest facts are.
And you should be happy. They're going into the hall just like you wanted. And I was joking about the weak thing, dude. Don't be so sensitive. Chill.... It's all good.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
faldor wrote:Bono wrote:I don't believe you could not argue that in the slightest. CD era did not keep them relevant in anyway whatsoever and with or without CD the band was going in as a 1st ballot inductee. Let's not misconstrue some peopel being aware that Axl is touring and released and album with Gn'R being relevant. The classic hits were not getting airplay based on CD's mythology and people attendeding tours in 2000-2007 were not attending them to hear CD era songs. Ok maybe a sprinkling of fans but c'mon. CD played no part in Gn'R's relevance in terms of public perception other than to fuel the idea that Gn'R sucks without Slash. Not something I'm saying but something that is the general consensus among the average Joe in my opinion.
Slash's activity with solo albums, guest spots and the existence of Velvet Revolver played a much bigger role in keeping the Gn'R name relevant in my opinion.
I think you missed my point, or maybe I didn't explain it well enough. I'm not saying CD helped them get into the Hall because of its greatness. I'm saying since there WAS a Chinese Democracy, there was reason for Axl to go on with the band, albeit without any original members. Therefore GNR didn't seize to exist in 1994.
And I'll agree, Slash becoming one of the most recognized guitarists, and VR helped keep the GNR memories alive as well.
You might be right, they may have gotten in just based off of their 6 year span even without anything that followed. But I do think each member remaining active in an assortment of ways helped a bit.
From my point of view, I've been a die hard GNR fan all my life and seen the ups and downs in popularity, and in the UK GNR pretty much disapeared from the public consciousness till about 2004 when greatest hits came out. Then all of a sudden GNR were cool again, getting airplay on the radio and spoken about in the media.
From the mid 90's till about 2004 I used to collect every article I ever came across, record every mention on TV - and they were few and far between, thats why I collected them, it was my favourite band and I got a kick out of seeing mentions of them.
But Greatest Hits changed that, and I firmly believe the successful 2006 Euro tour would have sold as badly as the abandoned 2001 Euro Tour if it wasnt for that albums success.
True. When people go to see GN'R, they want the old hits. Except a few nerds, nobody gives a flying F about CD. Just take a look at the current NA tour - people started to buy GH in serious amounts. It even re-entered the Billboard Top 200. Nobody bought CD. I guess it shows its relevance to the legacy.
Re: Guns N Roses OFFICIALLY inducted into Rock n Roll Hall of Fame
Yeah, over 2 million people are nobodies. Or just a few nerds. Yep.
But if a few nerds bought over 2 million copies of CD, how can they not give a flying F about it?
...Hold on, let me think about this.
