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- Topics: Active | Unanswered
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
Oh and Better is the best Guns N' Roses song ever.
I like the song but tap the brakes buddy. 
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
I've never heard Estranged on the radio either. But I think alot of people are forgetting there wasn't a 15-year wait for Estranged, grunge was at it's zenith, GN'R had already pimped the hell out of November Rain & Don't Cry the previous year, and by '93/'94, people were just done. They couldn't handle another Zeppelin song.
By the mid-90's rock had already made that transformation to "quick hits" imo. Now it wasn't just radio or industry people, but listeners themselves wanted 3-4 minute, straight-forward rock songs.
Estranged's reception to this day, and that TERRIBLE video does alot for it, it's remembered solely as the moment GN'R jumped the shark (or dolphin), and lost every ounce of their street cred that they had left.
Estranged was living proof that the next GN'R album was gonna have to be a grunge album (mid 90's), an industrial album (late 90's), or a post grunge album (early 2000's to the present).
Even Metallica had to re-invent themselves, and were pretty much fanboys of the direction AIC took.
I think TWAT would've been better recepted in 2008 after the long wait, even in a revisionist fashion, than Estranged was in 93/94.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
I also have that CD single that neemo has.
Personally I think the problem with estranged and the general public is twofold.
Firstly, while it's an excellent song, it's a conflicted and tormented work describing complex and dark emotions. That's the beauty of the song but I think it makes it harder for a well adjusted non-gnr fan to appriciate it - they're looking for love songs that go "yep that's my relationship" or rock songs that go "yeah I kick ass on the field like that" or "I want some ass" etc. Estranged touches on all kinds of themes, including suciede, and while many people have been there, it's not easy listening always and not something some people want to do. It reminds me of the movie AI - great movie I thought but so sad in places that even though you think it's a masterpiece you can't watch it every day or you get too upset.
Secondly, the timing, I don't even think it's the grunge thing as much as it just plain was released late into the cycle of UYI. It came out in 1993 when the album came out in 1991 - and this wasn't a quiet subtle release like CD - illusions where ALL over the media. It came pretty much at the concluson on the tour - 190 shows or whatever it was - and as a single it only had an album B-side. Bottom line to me is that it was released when almost everyone with a casual interest already had UYI...so most people getting the single were hardcore fans of the band like me buying it for the sake of completism.
- metallex78
- Rep: 194
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
I still remember Estranged making it's video debut on a local video hits show, and it was a BIG deal, because GN'R were still one of the biggest rock bands on the planet, regardless of the grunge movement at the time.
My mates and I sat in great anticipation to see it, and while a few laughed at how over the top it was, they still admitted it had some very cool moments as well. They also played Dennis Leary's Asshole video after, which was almost like the complete opposite of the Estranged video... 
I think it's all the stuff that Monkey pointed out, it was the end of the UYI cycle that was already running out of steam.
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
yeah misterid i agree 100 % in the end the vision he had to complete the story did in fact have to be altered big time. i fuckin loved all the videos they came out with for the illusions. so many videos if you think about it. big tour, lotta videos, award shows, real busy................
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chinese Democracy now $1.99
So wait a minute, audiences don't want to deal with suicide themes on Estranged, but All Apologies is a big fuckin' hit?
Yeah that's a fair point! Although All Apologies is a much more musically digestiable song too - it's got sort of an almost nursary ryme nature to the tune...it's simple enough that some may not notice the themes and just sing along to it casually. While estranged is so emotionally punishing in every note of every instrument.
But yeah I take your point.
I think the bigger issue is basicly how late it came out. I think if it had been released as one of the early singles of UYI it would have peformed strongly - I think by the time that single came out everyone and their dog already owned the albums.
