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Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Think I'm backing out of this debate
Me too. Arguing with someone just for the sake of doing so isn't my thing...well, not as much as it used to be anyway. My point is pretty clear (to most people, though I haven't taken a poll to confirm that).
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
my only problem with your argument Buzz is "the nobody cares anymore". All the promoters outside of the US are still throwing money at Axl. You don't headline Reading and Leeds for the 2nd time in this era if people don't care....you don't sell over 200,000 tickets down in South America if people don't care, and you don't sell close to 100,000 tickets on a mini Asian tour if people don't care. The Canadian tour did pretty good as well. They were in the top of the Billboard touring charts for all these tours. People do care and will pay to see an inferior Gnr if Axl is still involved. It's as simple as that. Of course, it isn't as successful as their prime, and there is no arguing that Slash would catapult them back to close to their heyday, but that doesn't necessarily mean "no one cares". 
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
my freinds that are musicians always wanna go se them cuz a) Axl still can put on a hell of a show and B) the guitar work is brilliant on both old and new stuff...with that said though, they have no interest in buying the new album..still they really liked the guitar work at the live show...people not into music so much have no interest in seeing the tour, hearing the album or playing the songs on RB2
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
As I mentioned before, if you really wanna find out if "no one cares" for real or not, ask these questions to your friends:
"Do you wanna listen to Chinese Democracy?"
"Do you wanna play some Chinese Democracy songs on Rock Band?"
"What do you think of newer Guns N' Roses songs?"
"Would you like to go see Guns N' Roses in concert?"
My friends are 40 years old. They don't go see U2 either and it is the original band. Nobody I know bought the new U2 album. We simply saw these bands in the day. Now is not the day and it wouldn't be no matter who is in the band. We went to see Van Halen because Diamond and Eddie hadn't played together since 1984. (my Junior year in High School.) Most of us left underwhelmed. You can't recreate seeing bands like Gnr and VH in their prime. No way in hell. Hard rock is a young man's sport.
By saying "my friends", you are completely forgetting about a whole generation of kids who grew up and began liking Gnr from 1995 to 2010, never saw the original band, have no connection to any members, and who just see Gnr is playing in my town. "Axl's still there, maybe there will be a riot!" The brand Gnr will always have a built in audience simply due to their reputation.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
For an accurate picture, try out any of these questions on your friends and notice their response:
"Do you wanna listen to Chinese Democracy?"
"Do you wanna play some Chinese Democracy songs on Rock Band?"
"What do you think of newer Guns N' Roses songs?"
"Would you like to go see Guns N' Roses in concert?"
You friends answers will prove buzz right.
Pretty much says the story.
I haven't met one person yet that sees this charade as Guns N' Roses or Chinese Democracy - a Guns N' Roses album.
It's like sitting there and arguing the merits of Halloween III to a Halloween fan. The decision has been made, it's done, the jury is out, new Guns - fuck off in the U.S.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
russtcb wrote:As I mentioned before, if you really wanna find out if "no one cares" for real or not, ask these questions to your friends:
"Do you wanna listen to Chinese Democracy?"
"Do you wanna play some Chinese Democracy songs on Rock Band?"
"What do you think of newer Guns N' Roses songs?"
"Would you like to go see Guns N' Roses in concert?"
My friends are 40 years old. They don't go see U2 either and it is the original band. Nobody I know bought the new U2 album. We simply saw these bands in the day. Now is not the day and it wouldn't be no matter who is in the band. We went to see Van Halen because Diamond and Eddie hadn't played together since 1984. (my Junior year in High School.) Most of us left underwhelmed. You can't recreate seeing bands like Gnr and VH in their prime. No way in hell. Hard rock is a young man's sport.
By saying "my friends", you are completely forgetting about a whole generation of kids who grew up and began liking Gnr from 1995 to 2010, never saw the original band, have no connection to any members, and who just see Gnr is playing in my town. "Axl's still there, maybe there will be a riot!" The brand Gnr will always have a built in audience simply due to their reputation.
Well put. I still think people are overestimating the strength, value, and potential of a GNR reunion. I think it'd be sort of comparable to VH. The tour would do well. They wouldn't be able to come up with new music and even if they did it would sell FAR below expectations.
The fanbase is so divided. Some took Slash's side and hate Axl and wouldn't approve of a reunion. And vice versa. Sure enough "fans" would be able to see past everything and the casual rock fan who liked GNR at one time would be interested. But they wouldn't set the world on fire and be the most dangerous band in the world again. It's just not happening. Been there, done that. It is what it is. For the most part, rock is dead. Pop music rules the world. I can't think a band outside of Nickelback that is routinely accepted by the popular audience. I don't know why or how it happened. Hair bands ruled the 80's and were popular to the masses. The 90's had grunge and alternative bands widely accepted. The early 2000's had rap rock and nu-metal. There's just nothing that appeals to people these days in the rock genre. It's all Lady Gaga, Miley Cyrus, Justin Bieber, Taylor Swift. Everyone always said that rap was just a fad and would die off but it has fared far better than rock in recent years in my eyes.
80's bands have had a bit of a resurgence in recent years but the kids just aren't all that interested in watching 50 year old guys rocking out onstage. So unfortunately this new version of Guns is a new lineup of older guys that people aren't all that familiar with. Obviously that's not a recipe for mainstream success. At least with the old lineup people are familiar with that and it feeds into the nostalgia hunger that people have. But I just don't think it'd be an otherworldly event like some people make it out to be.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Buzz hasn't responded to this post....your friends and the kids have NOTHING to do with the fact that Axl still sells tickets and concert promoters still pay him top dollar. Those are the FACTS. Your friends are irrelevant to the FACT that Gnr is being paid to Headline one of the biggest festivals in the world. SOMEBODY FUCKIN' CARES!:flame:
Again....where is the flaw in my logic.....
my only problem with your argument Buzz and now Russ is "the nobody cares anymore". All the promoters outside of the US are still throwing money at Axl. You don't headline Reading and Leeds for the 2nd time in this era if people don't care....you don't sell over 200,000 tickets down in South America if people don't care, and you don't sell close to 100,000 tickets on a mini Asian tour if people don't care. The Canadian tour did pretty good as well. They were in the top of the Billboard touring charts for all these tours. People do care and will pay to see an inferior Gnr if Axl is still involved. It's as simple as that. Of course, it isn't as successful as their prime, and there is no arguing that Slash would catapult them back to close to their heyday, but that doesn't necessarily mean "no one cares".
And don't give me this bullshit about how a US tour would tank. You are speculating because it hasn't fucking happened. There is no fact there...only speculation and opinion. Russ, furthermore, your example of Detroit as a sign of declining interest is not that relevant in the big picture as well. It is one city and one show out of close to 200 shows the new band has done. One sample out of 200 is hardly proof of anything. The world doesn't revolve around Detroit Michigan or the entire US for that matter. Your immediate friends and family's opinion of Chinese Democracy is irrelevant as well.
The fact is 2002 US tour avg 8600 and the 2006 avg was 8400. 2010 or 2011 remains to be seen. We don't know what will happen. If and when it tanks, I'll be the first in line to sing your praises, but until then I wish everyone would quit spitting out their OPINION as fact.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
the problem lies in the fact that its hard to relate to the musical landscape in other countries...but what is popular in europe isnt necessarily what folks in the USA like...but at the same time..just cuz the USA doesnt really care too much for a particular band doesnt mean that their world wide popularity isnt high
although to judge the relevancy of GnR at reading/leeds as being "in demand" i dont think thats a valid argument either cuz Arcade Fire and Blink 182 are also closing that festival 
though like i said people in England have different tastes in music than north americans
