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Re: This I Love
I agree with Bono. I love the solo and think Axl is the weak link here. I think the lyrics are borderline cheesy, but if he used a rasp, or sang it more like November Rain, and maybe lost one of the choruses and focused on the orchestrations (whch are fantastic, btw) it would be killer. His voice really throws me off.
As is, Robin saves the song.
i'd agree with this...the only redeeming thing about the song is the solo....though i only like about half of it...all in all the song should've been left in the vault IMO, its out of place on the album, and i hate the singing and lyrics on it...those 2 things above all else kill the song for me.
anyway for me to admit that robin save the song is something 
Re: This I Love
faldor wrote:I have a hard time believing that the average music listener would despise the song because of the solo though. Maybe I'm missing something, I just can't comprehend.
Its a lengthy solo. The casual radio listener will definitely take notice.
Are you trying to tell me that Hotel California becomes a hit if its Finck creating the solo?
I don't think so.
My point is, I just don't think the solo is that bad. I actually think it's quite good, that's why I don't think it'd kill the song for the average listener. Like Axlin, Bono, Neemo, misterID, and anyone else I'm leaving out have mentioned, the weak link (if there is such a thing) on this song is the vocals. Like I said before, it took me quite some time to warm up to this song and the only reason I did is because I'm a big fan. If I was just a casual listener I wouldn't have given it a second listen. I would've come away thinking, "man that new Guns song is sappy as hell. There's a cool guitar solo in it though. It's a really deep song, not my bag though." So I can understand people not liking the song in all, just not the solo. That I don't get.
Re: This I Love
It's simple to get. Everyone is a critic.
Many of us have been exposed to the production of this album step-by-step for a decade.
We all now think we're the second coming of Elton fuckin' John.
Some us sit back and say, This I Love, no guitar, more orchestra, others say cut the orchestra and turn up the guitar, some say more piano from Axl ala November Ran, etc.
We all think our opinion makes the music stronger, when it reality, at the end of the day it's Axl & Robin's vision for what they wanted to make it. It's their art, and that's how it is.
Regardless, Robin's guitar on no level imo makes This I Love. You can take the guitar completely out, and it's the SAME SONG. That's what the mark of good guitar work is. When you cannot do that. Even November Rain, you can remove the guitar, and it's the same song, just piano-driven. However, the same cannot be said for Estranged. The guitar makes it. The guitar makes TWAT too.
Re: This I Love
I just think people are overly critical when it comes to Robin's solo on TIL. I've never heard "Estranged" sans guitar so I can't really comment on if the song suffers without it or not. I think Robin's solo plays well off the orchestra. It works for me. I don't think I've ever heard a solo get slammed as much as this one. I have to think there's worse solos out there but you wouldn't know it by reading some of the comments. I just don't understand what people were expecting from the solo.
I'll agree Bucket's solo in TWAT is superior, but I just don't view Robin's work as harshly as some. Whatever, to each his own.
Re: This I Love
Here's the problem with the This I Love solo. Yes I slammed it in the other thread pretty harshly, but it was mainly to get a rise out of robin67, no offense by the way.
In reality Robin's solo, is not 'bad'. It's what it's 'missing' that is so glaring. I know it sounds Slashite, and tired, but... This I Love is aching for Slash. And I say that as the ONLY track on all of CD that needs Slash. The rest is fine. This is to not bash Robin. But This I Love needs a Slash-November Rain type of solo right there to take the wheel. What we get is actually just a complimentary solo to the orchestra, but then the orchestra is turned down in the mix, and I think that's where that section, the solo, fails.
Not to sound repetive, but it should've been reversed. The solo should've backed the orchestra to give it even more production and fat in the solo. Robin's solo, I don't think is bad, because Robin is bad (even though I don't think he's all that), it's just that the solo is missing something. It's missing that kick in the balls. Right when that part of the song comes up, you're waiting either for a big orchestral arrangement or a guitar solo. The song was built as such. Then you get the orchestra turned down, and kind of an average solo, and it kills what the song could be
Without even bringing up the obvious ones, like Sweet Child, NR or Estranged, let's just talk new Guns. Bucket on TWAT. Bucket on Sorry. Hell even Ron's solo on Shackler's Revenge. Those are solos that are just what the song called for, and made it complete.
This I Love's feels like not done enough or done too much (guitar), either way, it doesn't feel right. I keep harping on the orchestra, because i've heard the song's orchestra, with everything else practically turned off, and it's utterly amazing. The orchestra is so beautiful as an arrangment. I really think somewhere out there, there's a version of this song with just the orchestra and piano driving it, and no guitar, and that's originally the completed version.
Not offense to Robin, but the finished studio-This I Love solo almost comes across as a last minute Axl-ism to Robin "hey this needs a solo, because all GN'R piano ballads have solos, do it", and Robin did what he could.
The solo just comes across as an afterthought. And that's my biggest issue with it. Had I never in my entire life ever heard the vocals, piano or orchestra on the song, and just heard Robin's guitar, i'd probably go "hey, not bad". But with the rest, it's just kind of an anti-climax.
Bucket might've come up with something more soulful and right for the solo on This I Love, but in reality... I don't think it even needed a solo, at all.
If you were to give me Estranged, in it's finished form. Let it sit for 5 years, and go back to it, i'm sure i'd think about it enough that i'd over produce that fucker. By the time it was said and done, i'd have a backing symphony, horns, a flute, bells, and even wind charms. Then i'd have Zakk Wylde come in and redo Slash's guitar parts, because I think they could be a bit better, because Zakk was really awesome on No More Tears, oh yeah, and what if I brought in a children's church choir to sing backup vocals, yeah that'd be cool, and maybe get Shannon Hoon to do high vocals on the song, Layne Staley on low and Axl on mid, and put it all together...
Would it flow? Yes. Would it work? Yes. Would it fit together within the context of the song? Yes. Would it be too much? Yes.
And that's Robin's guitar solo in the context of This I Love. It's like French Fries. They are great with salt. But if you salt them too much, eventually they lose all flavor.
This I Love has no flavor, because of the guitar. It was one dash of salt too much.
Re: This I Love
nah dude plain and simple I think the fact is those who hate the solo hate it because they know how much Slash could've brought to it. It has nothing to do with the composition of the song or the mix or the orchestra or Buckethead or Robin but has everything to do with Slash. Problem here is its a really good solo but people know how GREAT Slash would've made it cause it's right up his alley and whether anyone wants to admit it or not Slash played off Axl(and vice versa) better than anyone ever has INCLUDING Buckethead. People disliking this solo would be like people disliking a Viper cause they think the Ferrari is better. I honestly believe people dislike the solo cause as good as it is, it's a glaring reminder of what's missing in today's Guns N' Roses. I don't even have to say what that is. We all know WHO that is.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: This I Love
^ Truest post ever bono.
I actually enjoy the TIL solo - I think the way it kicks in really captures a lot of pain and emotion really beautifully and that it elevates the song.
After hearing rock band I think it's a shame some of the harps and synth stuff is lost in the mix however.
But the issue to me is, Robin's done an A+ effort on this one, and the end result is somewhat killer to me, so i could call this finished and not complain about it.
But as much as Axl will hate us all for saying this, there is one man in this generation who is an expert on drawing out pure emotion in solos of this kind. Maybe he wasn't suited to the CD project overall, but on this track, well, you can just feel that this track is perfect for Slash. Robin's made a killer solo, but I feel slash might have done something truely spiritual there. And somewhere inside a lot of people feel that I think, and they see that lost chance and it hurts them, so they take swipes at robin's solo. I think robin's done the best possible Slash style solo that could go in that spot that anyone other than Slash himself could do. But that's the real problem.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: This I Love
can't u post something else than these "1 sentence wonders" of yours?
Yeah, enough of this joke already!
