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Re: If the Skwerl
buzzsaw wrote:LIf people downloaded the album, liked it, but didn't want to buy it, the singles would have done better because those people would have still supported the songs they liked.
Discuss.
I think alot of us can agree "Estranged" is one of our favourite songs, it didn't do too well as a single...
it didn't do well because people were getting fed up by the monster videos like don't cry and november rain. he swam with the dolphins ffs (we need a dolphin smiley 
). but at least he tried. with chinese gnr couldn't even be bothered to make a video. any kind of video: cartoons, live footage... maybe he didn't want to "make it big" with the album? he just put it out to get it off his back? hell if i know
Re: If the Skwerl
faldor wrote:See, here's the thing. I truly believe enough people were backing him up right through the release of this record. Radio stations across the country debuted the single at 6am the day it came out, they played the album in full the weekend it came out. The album was made available for download on Rock Band. These aren't things that happen with every release for every band. The mainstream media was primed for a Guns N' Roses comeback but all the momentum was quickly lost when nothing was done to support the singles, album, etc. Why should radio stations and the general public care when it doesn't seem like Axl does? I'm not saying Axl doesn't care, I'm just saying that's the public perception.
honestly, the fact that he didn't promote this album doesn't bother me that much really. it's the quality/production/final product. if the music is good and sounds nice there will be people buying the record. and i will buy it eventually but it will be just because, and that's disappointing to me. it's disappointing that i would rather listen to live versions of the songs on the album than the actual studio version.
Well that goes for you, and that's fine. If it's not your cup of tea, totally your perogative. Unfortunately some people out there need things shoved down their throats and need to be told what is good and what they should like. Hence why American Idol is so huge. So while quality music should be able to stand on its own, it sure doesn't hurt for it to be promoted heavily.
Re: If the Skwerl
AtariLegend wrote:buzzsaw wrote:LIf people downloaded the album, liked it, but didn't want to buy it, the singles would have done better because those people would have still supported the songs they liked.
Discuss.
I think alot of us can agree "Estranged" is one of our favourite songs, it didn't do too well as a single...
You're right. It was released after the grunge era started. I'm not going to go back and look it up, but unless proven otherwise, I'm going to assume that Estranged did better than either single off of CD. I'm not sure what your point is.
People download or buy an album, but don't buy the singles they like from it, because they already have them.
...And by the way, as a single "Estranged" only out performed "Chinese Democracy" in Australia. I'm only aware of "Better" being released as a single in the US.
Re: If the Skwerl
faldor wrote:buzzsaw wrote:Tell that to Nickleback and Coldplay. Also tell that to Carlos Santana who is older than everyone in GnRland.
It's a completely valid point, but one that the faithful supporters like to dismiss because, well, quite frankly it buries their point.
Name me one "ROCK" song by any of those artists you mentioned. Coldplay hasn't put out anything that's rocked ever. If you want Axl to start writing the quality of crap that Nickelback writes then you're on your own there. I'll pass on that. And Carlos Santana collaborated with pop stars to hit the hot 100. I see you're laying the groundwork for Slash's solo album. Again, you're missing the point. NO ROCK songs chart on the hot 100 these days. To say "Chinese Democracy" was a failure because it didn't is a baseless and ridiculous argument. One you can't seem to get over.
OK. I own this point. Even though I don't like either band, that is what "Rock" music is today. Let's move on.
How many "shitty" songs did better than CD and Better did on the "Rock" charts. Prove to me that the public liked the singles, because all the evidence I've seen suggests that even the "Rock" fans didn't get on board with either single. I remeber a time where CD and better were both on the "Rock" chart right around #20. Explain to me how that is success?
"Better" didn't fare too well on the mainstream rock chart. It peaked at #18. "Chinese Democray" did much better though, and I actually have to correct myself. I just looked it up on wikipedia and the debut single DID reach #34 on the hot 100. It peaked at #5 on the Mainstream Rock chart and was in the top 20 for a couple of months WITHOUT any video, promotion, interviews. Both singles were released into the wild to fend for themselves. Frankly, looking back on it, I'm surprised either charted as well as they did.
As for "rock" fans not being more receptive. I can't explain why Nickelback is successful. That blows my mind, my sister likes them, I can understand that. But how they chart well on "rock" charts, I don't understand. Coldplay has never made a "rock" chart, because they're not rock. I don't know what they hell they are.
Edit: Another correction, I guess Coldplay is considered "modern" rock, whatever that means. The harder rock bands show up on the "mainstream" chart, that's all I know.
Re: If the Skwerl
Well that goes for you, and that's fine. If it's not your cup of tea, totally your perogative. Unfortunately some people out there need things shoved down their throats and need to be told what is good and what they should like. Hence why American Idol is so huge. So while quality music should be able to stand on its own, it sure doesn't hurt for it to be promoted heavily.
true. and how do we shove it down people's throats? if our band is sitting on it's ass? do leaks help promotion if the band doesn't do nothing? or does it hurt album sales? unfortunately, there's no black or white here. some people that download then go out and buy the final product, some don't like it and don't buy it.
Re: If the Skwerl
faldor wrote:Well that goes for you, and that's fine. If it's not your cup of tea, totally your perogative. Unfortunately some people out there need things shoved down their throats and need to be told what is good and what they should like. Hence why American Idol is so huge. So while quality music should be able to stand on its own, it sure doesn't hurt for it to be promoted heavily.
true. and how do we shove it down people's throats? if our band is sitting on it's ass? do leaks help promotion if the band doesn't do nothing? or does it hurt album sales? unfortunately, there's no black or white here. some people that download then go out and buy the final product, some don't like it and don't buy it.
There's nothing "we" can do. It's all in the hands of the band at this point. If they're fine with the way things have gone, then it's time to move on. Axl said there were things planned for down the line intentionally. We'll have to see if any of that comes to fruition. It's never too late. Many albums take awhile to get noticed. Again, this album had momentum at the start and lost it all very quickly so this is a completely different scenario, but that's where we're at. Also, I realize Axl has said a lot of things in the past that have never come to pass, so his comment about possible future events could just be another example of that. Only time will tell.
- mickronson
- Rep: 118
Re: If the Skwerl
the only problem I have with downloaders is now the RIAA and other people seem to have more power than god
Re: If the Skwerl
do you remember 2006 when the better DEMO charted on the radio?
axl still had a lot of people backing him up right then and there. but somehow it all went astray.
2006 was it.
I had stopped caring about GN'R years ago, but Merck's "13 Tuesdays left" brought many old fans back into the fold.
The fucking lied to us and they fucking blew their chance.
The album should have been out in 2006.
Re: If the Skwerl
I truly believe enough people were backing him up right through the release of this record. Radio stations across the country debuted the single at 6am the day it came out, they played the album in full the weekend it came out. The album was made available for download on Rock Band. These aren't things that happen with every release for every band. The mainstream media was primed for a Guns N' Roses comeback but all the momentum was quickly lost when nothing was done to support the singles, album, etc. Why should radio stations and the general public care when it doesn't seem like Axl does? perception.
x 1,000,000 Well fucking said.
Re: If the Skwerl
I truly believe enough people were backing him up right through the release of this record. Radio stations across the country debuted the single at 6am the day it came out, they played the album in full the weekend it came out. The album was made available for download on Rock Band. These aren't things that happen with every release for every band. The mainstream media was primed for a Guns N' Roses comeback but all the momentum was quickly lost when nothing was done to support the singles, album, etc. Why should radio stations and the general public care when it doesn't seem like Axl does? perception.
Yep.
It was all lined up. All served for him, but he didn't bother to play game. He had his own way of doing it and it caught us all off guard.
We expected his approach was due to not having an album out, waiting for the time to be right etc etc. I did not expect him to not show up for this one, but all in all I should have seen it coming. It was naive.
The album had no real good single material, and if there is one, like This I Love or Better, it wasn't used. Instead the label went with one of the worst songs off the album because that song sounded closest to the old GNR.
It's hard selling apples to orange lovers.
