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Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
Oh, and Neemo,
I understand the original Clone Wars miniseries from 2002 was vastly superior to the animated film.
Haven't seen it yet, but might actually hunt it down.
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
polluxlm wrote:I don't see how they exclude each other sic.
Lucas is many things, but a great script writer is not one of them. That's why ANH utilizes Hidden Fortress and the characters are modeled after classic, greek traditions. That's why the reigns where handed over to other directors and screen writers in the latter part of the OT. They are vehicles to make his story work dramatically since he can't or won't do it himself. ANH is not Hidden Fortress, it's HF happening in the SW Universe. It's that Universe I'm talking about and the overall intent.
The direction your proposing is a natural one, and would have been the greatest dramatically. Yet Lucas chooses to go another way. He doesn't want the pessimistic ending. It would be the most realistic and interesting, but the point he wants to make is that you can actually win and have an all out happy ending. He wants people to feel that even the most helpless, primitive beings can defeat a mighty empire simply by applying greater numbers, cooperation and will. It doesn't work very well on screen, but that is what he was trying to do.
The kids aspect is obvious imo. Jar Jar, CGI, Ewoks, happy, pompous endings and corny comic relief. And I gotta say, he succeeded. My nephews and step brothers love the new films as much as we did the old. Still he's retained a lot of serious themes. Deep societal commentary, and the classic dramatic hooks are still there. It just doesn't flow as well as it used to when looked at with technical eyes.
- dr_love6977
- Rep: 38
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
I haven't seen the Clone Wars animated movie, but the only possible way it could have improved upon the miniseries is in visual value. The miniseries was absolutely perfect.
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
In that case, I must say that I feel sorry for the children, as when considered objectively in terms of storytelling, The Phantom Menace is vastly inferior to A New Hope. The universe you speak of has no clear-cut dramatic form in the later film, simply a world which I can certainly commend him for creating. A fine car without an engine, going in circles in attempt to cover the groundwork laid down two decades prior. I find it hard to imagine TPM as an great individual film as ANH, even if it should be - not least because we are to bear witness to the opening of a rather grand and ambitious saga.
Moreover, the argument on toys as part of the decision-making in the creative process is a dangerous one. While undeniable, it could be said that Batman & Robin was built upon the same aspect. Happy Meals and action figures. While children often enjoy films with lesser dramatic surge than adults, the magic of the original trilogy (or at least the first two films) was that they appealed to all age groups. Why? Because there was a good story behind it, based on the source materials mentioned. When such an element is lacking, we end up with a dodgy recreation of the cinematic Michael Jackson's Neverland.
I cannot decipher Lucas' message anymore, and remain rather cautious regarding his intentions. This is because I acknowledge the influence he has over a great many viewers and when he starts investing too much attention to matters beyond the basic narrative, it gets unsettling. Should children on a by far and large embrace his cinematic vision, the problem which'd arise is that they'd be accustomed into a noticeably different narrative tradition than that of the original trilogy. The original films were highly influential to a whole generation of moviegoers, giving them their initial homework on text-book dramaturgy as films like Seven Samurai and The Magnificient Seven had done before.
That is my main concern regarding the new trilogy. At worst, it'll set up a pretext to the cinematic language of the next generation, which will be one diminished when regarded next to the original films. Should the film as an artwork be considered a short run for the toys and various accessories, I begin to feel very unconfortamble with the direction things are heading. The Matrix sequels tried that, tying up the video game and the animations into the plotline, which didn't gain an all-out favorable response.
While this may be the future of entertainment, I fear it downplays the value of cinema. I do admit such an approach would fit in to Lucas' apparent desire to create an all-encompassing SW universe [for a pioneer in cross-medium works, see Peter Greenaway's Tulsa Luper Suitcase], but should it would be used as an excuse to discard dramaturgical backlashes and plot holes, the impression gotten is that the artist doesn't have as much respect towards his audience as he once did.
Moreover, the minute you begin to reach out to the children via any method additional to the silver screen, you find your hand reaching for the daddys wallet - no matter what your intentions are. Obviously, this allows a very nasty economical flavor spill over to the original artwork itself, as mass appeal via children is an excellent way to neuter any project from potentially harmful elements. Greedo pulling a gun on Han Solo springs to mind.
I'm not altogether sure whether we're debating on the exact same issue here, but I hope this'll help you understand where I'm coming from with my concerns over Lucas' more recent body of work.
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
I've recently experienced a resurgence in my Star Wars fanatasism
i recently purchased the prequel trilogy online for $30 for 6 disks
i watched everything! even the special features and man i muist say Lucas is a genious,,,i wasnt overly fond of the prequels before but after watching them again they are fucking brilliant!
and the people that made those films a reality need to be commended for their fantastic work...did anyone know that there are points in episodes 2 and 3 where some characters are fully rendered and not really people? i was in shock when i was watching these documentaries on the bonus disks
and the lightsaber duels in 1, 2 and 3 are amazing...especially the obiwan/darth vader one in epi 3
additionally the new clone wars cartoon is really good stuff
Man this is so randombut I rewatched all the starwars again lately even the clone wars film and am starting to watch the clone wars cartoons and series now too. I LOVE STAR WARS. I think Episode 3 is my favourite of ALLL 6 films. They are so underrated. I even been on wookieepedia.com a lot rading up about charecters that don't even appear in the films.
Check out this star wars mosaic of the last supper made with stills from all 6 films
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
I actually think the story is very interesting and not developed well in the movies. The books are far more telling than the movies are. A lot of what happened and thoughts that were in people's heads are not portrayed well (or at all in some cases) in the movies. I don't think the problem is with the stories, I think the problem is with the way the movies were made and edited to entertain rather than be true to the story.
it was too good of deal to turn down
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
I recently rewatched Episode 1 and wow just wow. The Lightsaber duel was fantastic. However that still doesn't change the fact I had to sit through almost two hours of boring crap before it. The pod race was just a big CGI crapfest and Jar Jar whilst sometimes ammusing really got in the way of a lot of scenes and ruined major sections of the movie. Kid anakins acting was horrible as was portmans as padme. I know Cristensen was slightly better in the next two films but not by much and Portman luckily improved a lot in II and III. There's a fan-edit of the film on torrent sites which apparently greatly improves the film by removing many aspects i.e. Jar Jar antics and cuts out uneccesary cringe-worthy dialogue. One thing to close with though: Liam Neeson playing Qui Gon Jinn was superb. I really wish his character hadn't been killed of in this movie just so we could see him again in the later episodes of the prequel trilogy.
- Communist China
- Rep: 130
Re: The Star Wars Thread *NO SPOILERS ALLOWED!*
I know what you mean, he does a god job, but under Qui Gon's guidance would Anakin still turn out evil? He'd have to die pretty early on or the original canon would've been disturbed, Obi-Wan talks about personally training him from practically the start.
