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Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
After several months of not listening to CD I decided to listen to it all the way through, to see how its held up... Man, even with its flaws, what a great fucking album. My initial feeling was mostly negative, mainly because of Bumble's re-recording and contributions that basically crowds the songs, which I still think it does. But its really grown on me.
TWAT still blows me away. I still think Better and Prostitute are some of Axl's best songs. Shackler and Scraped have also really grown on me, and I've been listening to them a lot. Even CD, which really caught my ire because of Ron's guitar, has totally returned as one of my favorite GNR songs, period.
If The World might be my favorite track on the album. And it was my least favorite of the leaks.
I'm still a bit meh on This I Love, but I love the music and Robin's solo. The Blues has got much easier to listen to, but the demo is still far superior, so are a few live versions. And I still hate the lyrics for Sorry. Mostly because the music is so great and it was a killer opportunity for a great song, but Axl decides to approach it from the standpoint of a immature 14-year-old who hates his parents... But even with that, its still a pretty fucking cool song.
You could really say the songs don't mesh or flow, because they came from various periods of nuGNR with different people, bringing in different vibes, like IRS and TWAT against Shacklers and Scraped... Sorry against Madagascar... But the songs strangely do flow... It fits this kind of manic, unpredictable structure that's really refreshing. And imo, the album is the perfect embodiment of the enitre CD saga. It's definitely got me wanting to hear more. And it also has me interested in what a '02 or '99 version of CD would have been like.
CD could have been better, but I think its still a great album. In a funny way, all of GNR's albums have been imperfect masterpieces, and CD fits that mold perfectly.
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
Axl was close with Chinese but it was killed by "time" and business. The best albums were recorded and released within a year....02 would be the mix or time I would want to hear. However, kinda like saying, I wish the Braves still had Maddux, Glavine, and Smoltz.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
I listened Better yesterday, after like a year, and I was surprised, cause I thought it was better. I didn't even wait till the end of the song. Better is very forced, like the whole album. Axl wanted to make something great and contemporary and artistic, but he wanted it too hard, without great ideas to start with, and the zillion layers couldn't hide that most of the songs based on nothing.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
I really agree with a lot of MisterID's post.
I think some of the songs are definately amongst axl's best work, and amazing songs in their own right and that overall it's a fantastic album.
I can understand why the various versions of the songs, the wait and everything has influenced some people, and I think it's fair to say it's a very unique album, and that most likely another album will never be made in the same way, so much money, time, and so many different collaborators. It's a unique project, but I honestly believe the end results are fantastic. It's tough to swallow if you expect something entirely a certain way, as this album does things in it's unusual way, but once you look at it like that, you see through the politics and realise it's fucking great.
I think bumble gave an interview someplace where he said something similar. That it's the only porject of it's kind, and that rather than argue about who's missing from the album, or which of the players is better than who, it's best to just enjoy it as a musical journey that will probably never be done again. And I tend to agree...I mean bumble and bucket on the one album, some of the dramas over the period. Everything that's happened to the band and to all of us waiting in the mean time. The whole thing is kind of epic in nature.
I understand that some people feel the songs are crowded or tinkered with to the point of death, and to an extent I feel that's valid and can see what they mean, but I can also look past that, and I see a method in "axl's madness" - for right ot wrong - I honestly believe Chinese is one of the best albums in years and years, and while it's a different GNR from AFD, a different animal, I think it should also be recgonised as a work of genius and I only pray that in time the politics will allow for that.
I know that sounds fan boy and extreme. But the songs move me a lot. I really feel its some of Axl's best work. And while i personaly can understand that some people are frustrated with the rest of the GNR saga....for me the songs make up for it all.
- metallex78
- Rep: 194
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
Some songs still fall a little short on being great (Scraped, IRS), but the epic ballads is where Axl really shines.
I think you have to be in a certain mood to listen to CD, it's not like cranking up AFD to rock out and party to. But if you wanna listen to some deep melancholy songs along the lines of Estranged, I reckon Chinese Democracy more than delivers on that front.
I've listened to CD in the car recently, and I still get some of that "fuck, this is awesome" from some tracks like I get from old GN'R.
Axl set out to continue making epic rock music that was started to appear on UYI, so in that respect, CD is certainly a great album.
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
well i totally understand where you are coiming from, with this album you truely have to set aside all the baggage and approach the album with a clear mind...prolly true for all of the ex memebers of gnr...there comes a point imo where knowing too much about someone is a bad thing, for example peoepl ask me if i'll be rooting for tiger woods next weekend...i say yeah, i dont give a shit what he does in his personal life, he's still a great golfer...maybe the best that has ever lived, and he's definaltly not the first athlete to have extramarital affairs
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
Speaking of Tiger Woods. Saw this posted at HTGTH a couple days ago. In honor of Tiger's comeback next week, ESPN's Page 2 rated the top 50 comebacks of all time and GNR took its rightful place at #31 on the list and I couldn't agree more with what they said.
http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/?topId=5050080
31. Guns N' Roses
With "Appetite for Destruction," "G N' R Lies" and the two "Use Your Illusion" albums, Guns N' Roses became the biggest rock band in the world by the early 1990s. Then they stopped releasing original material and began shuffling their lineup. Lead singer Axl Rose teased the masses by promising that a new album, "Chinese Democracy," was definitely coming. In late 2008, more than 17 years after the "Use Your Illusion" albums were released, it finally arrived. And we loved it. But did anyone else? (Seriously, how did "I.R.S." not get more airplay?)
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Just listened to Chinese Democracy again...
^ To me it sort of displays how complex the world is.
Like if Chinese Democracy had sucked, and had been shocking, then everyone could have just called Axl wrong. We could just say "It's NOT gnr, you DON'T make the band what it is alone etc". And I do think elements of that are true - the old band WAS what it was because of the contributions of each of the members. But the faciniating thing is, despite all that, to me, Axl HAS managed to create a new masterpiece album, and it's style is like UYI and worthy of the GNR name.
So it's sort of a paradox I live in. Where on one hand I understand people who feel GNR was Axl and Slash and so on, but at the same time I love the new songs, and what bumble has done, and think the new album is fucking amazing. So in a way I thought Axl was wrong, but he also turned out right.
It's almost like a bizzaro world I live in. Where there's an alternate GNR now, and it's really different from the original GNR, but somehow it also has it's powers. Yet at the same time as that, it's also true that nothing will ever be AFD and old GNR again but that exact thing. So it's really a paradox in the extreme in my mind.
