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Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
I think people forget that Slash is just a guitar player. He's not Jimi Hendrix who explored the lead vocalist role. His voice is limited to his instrument and his abilities around that.
Every guitar player I can think of has a sound and a style that, no matter how hard they try, they actually become more like themselves as the years go by, right form the blues guys..Joe Perry & Slash to the metal guys..Dimebag & the boys in Slayer, Kirk & James..to the avand guard..Vai & Satriani....and even guys like the Edge.
No matter how much experimentation they did, it came back to their style.Slash is a global icon in 2012, despite having left his band that defined him in 1995..that is an incredible achievement.
I also have issues with aspects of his work to date but if I'm to be honest, I'm just heaping too much expectation upon him because Axl isn't there to enjoy also.
Steak is great but Surf & Turf is even better and that's what the two boys were.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Other than hoping my favorite bands have good sales to entice them to keep going, I dont factor in album sales and stardom when discussing the music. If we're going that route, lets just say Whitney Houston and Mariah Carey are better than both bands.
Not talking sales, talking impact. Plenty of shit artist have sold millions but they're not remembered. GN'R managed to walk that fine line between street cred and massive popularity. That's the difference, whether you prefer something like SG or not.
I'd like to discuss these two albums in more detail in a separate thread soon. Have you listened to the full album yet?
Yeah a couple of times, and we could do something like that.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Nobody has been able to replace Slash. Nobody has been able to replace Axl...Slash couldn't even do it with Duff and Matt (and Izzy part-time). You're talking about two of the best at what they do. I think sometimes we take for granted just how good it was because of everything that has happened since then. I think sometimes we're too close to it. I can't begin to tell you how much better I feel about all of it now that I've seen Slash and seen Axl live this year. I really feel like it's all come full circle for me and I'm completely at peace with it all. The only thing left for me is them make peace with it (reunion or no reunion).
I don't want a reunion because it would ruin what was so great. Axl simply doesn't have the goods anymore. Watched Ritz '88 earlier tonight and it just reinforces my belief even more that there should not be a reunion. Not only can you not get back Axl's incredible performance ability 25 years after the fact, you can't get the chemistry in the band back either. Even though it was a sloppy performance, it still blows your doors off when you watch it. Old guys performing stuff for nostalgia instead of young guys still trying to become successful and playing with as much hunger/energy imaginable. It's just not the same and it can never be.
That being said, I do want to see peace at some point. It isn't good for the soul to hold grudges like that, especially against people that helped make you rich. I want to see the vault opened up and some Blu-rays released of all their old concerts. I want to see the UYI Documentary released. That is the best way to honor the band's legacy IMHO. The fans would love to have these things and it wouldn't compromise the band's reputation at all to release them. The fans want a reunion too, but that is just a case of selfishness and short-sightedness. The time for a real reunion is long gone and people should let go.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
The point was all of those other bands went through conflicts and potentially band-ending and life threatening dramas. Only GNR never found a way out of it.
Only GN'R? What about the Pistols? To me, THAT is the real comparison. GN'R was a more talented version of the Sex Pistols. Psycho frontman and drug-addicted musicians surrounding him. Destined to crash and burn. Part of what makes their debut album stand up so well today is the title turned out to be prophetic. Only thing that could have made it an even more legendary situation is if they all died in the prime of their careers. The two guitarists OD on heroin, the drummer OD's on heroin, the bassist OD's on alcohol, and the singer shoots himself in a bipolar fit of rage.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Interesting.
I see the pistols as a very different comparison.
Weren't they basically a manufactured band with no musical ability dreamed up by Malcolm McLaren to promote his alternative culture store ? Turned out they got popular and started the punk movement but the reason it died in the ass was it was fake from the beginning so it had no place to go.
To me GNR is the polar opposite of that. Whatever else they are, the guys in GNR were real, with real musical ability, real drive to create stuff and nothing simulated about it.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
Interesting.
I see the pistols as a very different comparison.
Weren't they basically a manufactured band with no musical ability dreamed up by Malcolm McLaren to promote his alternative culture store ? Turned out they got popular and started the punk movement but the reason it died in the ass was it was fake from the beginning so it had no place to go.
To me GNR is the polar opposite of that. Whatever else they are, the guys in GNR were real, with real musical ability, real drive to create stuff and nothing simulated about it.
The last word I would use to describe the Pistols would be "fake." Izzy himself was once quoted that the last kick in the ass rock and roll received before GN'R was the Pistols. Regardless of how they were formed, the members themselves weren't fakes. They had an edge to them that was severely lacking in pretty much all of the mainstream music at that time. They had a volatility to them that earned them the name "world's most dangerous band." Sound familiar?
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
I guess. I just question if it was ever really about the music with them. Even though GNR were hardcore druggies as well, there's no doubt to me that Slash is putting his emotions into his guitar and that Axl is living those lyrics in honesty. Sex Pistols to me seems like the same dangerous lifestyles but without the truth in the music.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
monkeychow wrote:Interesting.
I see the pistols as a very different comparison.
Weren't they basically a manufactured band with no musical ability dreamed up by Malcolm McLaren to promote his alternative culture store ? Turned out they got popular and started the punk movement but the reason it died in the ass was it was fake from the beginning so it had no place to go.
To me GNR is the polar opposite of that. Whatever else they are, the guys in GNR were real, with real musical ability, real drive to create stuff and nothing simulated about it.
The last word I would use to describe the Pistols would be "fake." Izzy himself was once quoted that the last kick in the ass rock and roll received before GN'R was the Pistols. Regardless of how they were formed, the members themselves weren't fakes. They had an edge to them that was severely lacking in pretty much all of the mainstream music at that time. They had a volatility to them that earned them the name "world's most dangerous band." Sound familiar?
And yet they were assembled in the same way bands from X-Factor and Idol shows are assembled.
If the sex pistols aren't "fake" then neither is Kelly Clarkson, One Direction, Leona Lewis,
or any of the rest of them.
Regardless of how they were formed? There is no such thing as "regardless of how tey were formed". You might as well say "regardless of the fact that Unicorns don't exist, Unicorns are the greatest animals to walk this earth".
They had the edge that their manager told them to have. The drummer now plays in a band with members of Girl and Def Leppard "Man-Raze".
Johhny Rotten makes butter adverts and was more interested in new-wave synth pop than he ever was in "Rock". In fact he's quite scathing about "rock music". Steve Jones writes pop tunes and he's damned good at it, meanwhile their bassist is dead because he WASN'T tough enough to endure his own make believe image.
Did you know that Steve played all his bass-parts on the record before he joined the band by the way?
I've also heard motley crue described as the worlds most dangerous band, empty meaningless words used to promote "badass muthfuckers" to teenage boys.
I can show you, right now a hundred artists with more merit than both GNR and the Sex Pistols put together, but because they have no marketing machine behind them telling you how "hardcore" their image is you won't pay any attention.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
McLaren knew how to shape and promote the Pistols, which is where the national exposure came from.
This doesn't take away the fact that they were apparently a stonking live band in their prime, despite the fact that Glen Matlock, arguably the most musically-inclined member at the time, was switched to Sid Vicious, a never-do-well fan who bought into the hype and didn't know how to play bass in the first place.
Rotten/Lydon grew to hate his legacy with a passion and made much more interesting music with Public Image Limited over the years. Certainly not punk rock, or even rock, but noteworthy none the less. If you want to believe it, he claims he used the butter money to finance their latest studio album, This is PIL.
And hey, without the Sex Pistols, we might've never had Joy Division.
Re: Chris Cornell: "Guns N 'Roses were all normal types minus one"
buzzsaw wrote:Nobody has been able to replace Slash. Nobody has been able to replace Axl...Slash couldn't even do it with Duff and Matt (and Izzy part-time). You're talking about two of the best at what they do. I think sometimes we take for granted just how good it was because of everything that has happened since then. I think sometimes we're too close to it. I can't begin to tell you how much better I feel about all of it now that I've seen Slash and seen Axl live this year. I really feel like it's all come full circle for me and I'm completely at peace with it all. The only thing left for me is them make peace with it (reunion or no reunion).
I don't want a reunion because it would ruin what was so great. Axl simply doesn't have the goods anymore. Watched Ritz '88 earlier tonight and it just reinforces my belief even more that there should not be a reunion. Not only can you not get back Axl's incredible performance ability 25 years after the fact, you can't get the chemistry in the band back either. Even though it was a sloppy performance, it still blows your doors off when you watch it. Old guys performing stuff for nostalgia instead of young guys still trying to become successful and playing with as much hunger/energy imaginable. It's just not the same and it can never be.
That being said, I do want to see peace at some point. It isn't good for the soul to hold grudges like that, especially against people that helped make you rich. I want to see the vault opened up and some Blu-rays released of all their old concerts. I want to see the UYI Documentary released. That is the best way to honor the band's legacy IMHO. The fans would love to have these things and it wouldn't compromise the band's reputation at all to release them. The fans want a reunion too, but that is just a case of selfishness and short-sightedness. The time for a real reunion is long gone and people should let go.
I see your point, and based on Axl's performances since 2011, I completely agree. He's pretty miss these days (with occasional hit) but mostly miss.
But I completely disagree on band chemistry. Axl seems to have fantastic chemistry with Izzy & Duff when they play with Guns in the present day, so much to the point that you forget the other guys are even there. NONE of the new band has that kind of chemistry with Axl. NONE. Even dating back to 2001.
I think Slash is no different. If there were peace with Axl & Slash, they'd be explosive on stage again chemistry-wise imo, no different than Izzy & Duff, something Axl will never and has never had with the new band. Ever.
Let the reunion happen... then let's talk on chemistry. But I do agree I find myself questioning whether an Axl-led reunion in 2013 would be all that fun.
I'd love to see Axl REST HIS VOICE for a year or so, but keep it in shape by vocal exercises... THEN attempt a reunion tour. He still has ability, so it's there. It just needs work. You might get 2010 Axl with 2013 Slash, Izzy, Duff & Steven/Matt. That'd fucking rule.
