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Re: have you ever wondered...
I think some of it may be explained by that, but I think the most obvious reason is simply they are two different people.
Another thing is, we got told about Axl supposedly being paranoid years ago, well when Slash has the kind of memory he does, it can't help.
- shotgunblues1978
- Rep: 11
Re: have you ever wondered...
btw all my claims above are speculation...i jsut wanna make it clear, and i dont wanna be misquoted or misunderstood
as for the "Slash trashed Axl publically for years" comment, i dont buy it, i dare anyone to drag up as many derogatory Axl comments from Slash as they can....there isnt many as you wanna beleive. if peopel post a bunch of example of Slash bashing Axl i'll humbly back down and apologise, but i've followed this band "forever and a day" and i honestly dont recall anything really scathing coming from slash
anyway i'm not on the Slash bandwagon right now, the thought just struck me and i thought it'd be somethign to discuss....a new take on an old topic so to speak...
an example in my own life....someone keeps calling me at work right, and every time its like "wadya want now" , then it becomes a bit of a comedy, then it really starts to annoy the hell outta me, its like fuck off already, on top of that if you have somebody in the other ear telling you how much of an idiot the guy it then it also increases agrivation....so (just theory again) say in one ear we got beavan/zutaut....they say, "Axl...ya know Robin/BH are pretty cool but did you ever think of calling Slash" and in the other ear you got Beta/Del saying God Slash is a fucking prick, remember the time..." eventually you are gonna reach your breaking point and say...."fuck you and fuck Slash, hes a damn cancer" or somethign...know what i mean?
anyway again yeah its just speculation....the vicious animosity that Axl seems to have for Slash is a bit mind boggling to me
I'm not trying to avoid your question, just don't have time to dig up the articles right now, but to me it's not so much that what Slash said was insidious on the surface, but that he told blatant, flat out lies with the sole purpose of making himself look like the good guy and Axl appear to be the only cause of the breakup which the general public bought
Two examples are his claims that Axl wanted to make a techno album, wanted to sound like Pearl Jam, was treating Guns like his solo project, etc. It is also worth noting that Sorum stated that Duff and Axl were both on one side of the fence and the rest of the band was on the other, while Slash was trying to make it out that it was Axl alone. Later on in his book he said that creative differences in regards to musical direction had nothing to do with the breakup, but that's not what he said from 1995-2004.
The next example is his blackmail claim regarding the name. Axl pointed it out and anyone with even rudimentary knowledge of business law understands that a contract signed under circumstances like that is voidable. In civil law, it is not innocent until proven guilty, it is preponderance of evidence, which means that each side states their case and whichever side is more than 50% correct wins. In this case, if Axl had blackmailed the others into signing over the name and it was a he said-she said thing, and four people were claiming that it was signed under duress while one person was claiming otherwise, the contract would be voidable. Obviously there was more evidence than that, and it favored Axl, which means there were likely witnesses and other people who knew the true nature of the contract. Therefore it becomes apparent that Slash was lying about a story that has done a tremendous amount of damage to Axl's rep over the year and has been accepted as fact by the general public
Slash proved himself to be a liar with the infamous visit to Axl's house incident, which went from "I never went to his house" to "I went there to talk about a lawsuit" to "I went there to apologize for how things turned out" in a matter of months. Maybe not directly related but nonetheless shows how he has no problem lying to save face and make himself look better but in this case he got caught up in his own lies
Re: have you ever wondered...
all in all though nothing there to warrant undying hatred towards someone...at least by my standards
as for the pearl jam thing and the techno thing
listen to OMG and Riad and Shacklers and SIlkworms and tell met there isnt techno influences in those tracks
the pearl jam story was also told by Zakk Wylde and then Axl tried out the orig PJ drummer to fill sorum's shoes, so i dont think thats outside the realm of possibility either
the name thing as well is a much heatly debated topic, but there you have Slash (and others) on one side and on the other you have Axl's story... the truth most likely lies somewhere in the middle....i'll say this, just cuz Axl owns the name (cuz he made it up or whatever...shouldnt extend to the back catalogue, but in this case it somehow ended that way..anyway we all know the stories, this thread isnt meant to be about what Slash and/or Axl have said said or didnt say, its more about finding the reason behind the Hate (which Axl never really explained the reasons, he just hates him...cuz he does)
ya know waht i mean though shotgun...those reasons you listed, are they enough for you to eternally hate someone? like to the death kinda hatred?
Re: have you ever wondered...
Axl was clearly following 90s trends. Slash said it, Izzy said it, Zakk said it, and we have the music as proof. Silkworms sounds like a Prodigy reject, Riad a Praxis outtake, and the ballads fit more with the 90s than they do now.
As far as Axl hating Slash, we'll never understand it unless he states the clear reasons for that hatred. Its gotta be something more personal than we know, thats for sure. I don't really care though. I'd rather he move on and have his late 40s/early 50s be a prolific period than idle bullshit and Slash obsession.
Re: have you ever wondered...
I also don't understand why Axl doesn't just go into detail. He's already called him a cancer. It doesn't get any worse from there, unless he said something derogatory about him being a jew or black. Axl should just go ahead and dish it out if he's gonna start something. I think business however dicates that he can't run down a legendary guitarist from his band's legacy however. jmo
But as far as Axl getting sick and tired of being told he needs Slash. We'll i've never though Axl needs Slash. I don't think Slash needs Axl either. Axl has plenty of talent to go off and do something amazing solo (CD), and Slash has talent to go off and do something else (VR).
But as "GUNS N' ROSES" - yes, they need each other. Slash would never be able to tour successfully as GN'R, without Axl, and Axl's GN'R without Slash, their success has been modest at the absolute most ball-licking biased best.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: have you ever wondered...
I think it has more to do with Slash spending several years trashing him publicly, particularly saying things that were completely untrue simply for the purpose of making himself look better and Axl look worse
The problem to me is that all of these guys have musical genius, but none of them have acted like saints.
I don't think it's so much that Slash trashed Axl, it's more that slash stoped doing his previous role of apoligising for GNR's dramas. I love Axl's work dearly, he's an inspiration to me, but I think it's fair to say that by 1993 he already had a turbulent relationship with the media: There is 'Get in the Ring', the is 'one in a million', there is the st louis incidents, the other Axl arrests, the public rants, the canceled shows. he was already a controversial figure without any help from Slash. Now this isn't to suggest the resy of the guys are saints either, slash was a junkie, duff a drunk...they all had their issues. But prior to Slash leaving...you get almost any Slash interview and he's asked questions about Axl's behavior, and he'll always answer them in ways to defend GNR and defend Axl. Once he left the band he stoped doing that. He'll call a spade a spade and not defend stuff like cancelations, delays and other things that he used to help make excuses for. But that's also not the same as really trashing Axl, usually when interviewers really get into the bashing he starts to look uncomftorable and eitehr changes the subject or says about how he and axl were friends for a long time first. Anyway my point is theres a difference beteen Axl bashing, and just not helping out anymore.
Also...some of the things people say are slash lies are matters of perception. Like Axl wanting to do techno and industrial - maybe that's not true in the scheme of things - but to a guy like Slash who is raised on aerosmith maybe anything with a synth strikes him that way. Him saying Axl wanted to make it a solo project - prob not true overall - but then maybe in slash's head that's how he reconciles some of the decisions Axl's made that are unfathomable to him - like having a guy like Huge come in and overdub over Slash's solo. I mean look at it from his perspective, slash plays on AFD and built the band with Axl, who the fuck is huge to come in and redo stuff? of course Axl sees things differentlly...Axl is working on making a brilliant song that bit better and not limiting himself to strict ideas of who a guitarist is or whatever. But do you see how each of them can not be lying but both have an entirely different view about what happened and what the other could think.
I'll grant the name story doesn't make sence cos it would be duress. However...there's the long term issues too. Maybe axl didn't directly theaten those things - but the long term history of the band did. I mean - he gets in fights, no-shows at times, and was known for being tempremental at the time. Would you expect it to go well if you rejected his offer? or even if that's all bullshit. What is axl's version of the story then? It seems to be that Slash just made that up to cover for being dumb enough to sign over the rights. Still doesn't make Axl a saint...if slash is really so dumb as to sign over control of the brand he helped create for nothing, no finance, all cos he didn't give a shit, what kind of guy does that make Axl to take advantage of the stupidity of his bandmate, friend, and 'gang member' that way? Yet apparently slash is the asshole according to GNR. I'm not saying either of them is right. I'm just saying none of it makes any sence to me at all. And there's clearly either a lot more going on behind the scenes. Or it's that both their personalities are just so imcompatable that neither of them has really ever understood what the other was thinking or saying and its just got way out of hand.
Re: have you ever wondered...
all in all though nothing there to warrant undying hatred towards someone...at least by my standards
as for the pearl jam thing and the techno thing
listen to OMG and Riad and Shacklers and SIlkworms and tell met there isnt techno influences in those tracks
the pearl jam story was also told by Zakk Wylde and then Axl tried out the orig PJ drummer to fill sorum's shoes, so i dont think thats outside the realm of possibility either
the name thing as well is a much heatly debated topic, but there you have Slash (and others) on one side and on the other you have Axl's story... the truth most likely lies somewhere in the middle....i'll say this, just cuz Axl owns the name (cuz he made it up or whatever...shouldnt extend to the back catalogue, but in this case it somehow ended that way..anyway we all know the stories, this thread isnt meant to be about what Slash and/or Axl have said said or didnt say, its more about finding the reason behind the Hate (which Axl never really explained the reasons, he just hates him...cuz he does)
ya know waht i mean though shotgun...those reasons you listed, are they enough for you to eternally hate someone? like to the death kinda hatred?
Some people are more forgiving then others. Axl has every right to hate anyone he wants to, Slash is no exception. You or I, or many others, could probably see past some faults and be more forgiving. Not everyone is that easy going though. And all in all, we don't know everything that went down. But I'm certain it doesn't help the situation when the people around Axl are constantly telling him how bad Slash is and how he's 100% correct on all accounts.
I really didn't follow the GNR saga all that closely until 2003 or so, so I can't really comment on what may or may not have been said prior to then. From Axl's tone though, it's MUCH more than what was listed above. But again, even if it's ONLY that. He still has every right to hate Slash till his last dying day. Not saying it's right, but it is HIS right.
Re: have you ever wondered...
It's been said before, but Axl REALLY REALLY needs to write his own book. It'd be as big as the bible imo. If not, he'd be the only cat to have some much shit in his life, that he could turn his autobiography into a 'franchise'.
He's got book sequels in his autobiography. 
AXL: The Early Years
AXL II: Guns N' Roses
AXL III: My Cup Runneth Over
AXL IV: Downloading Mother Fuckers
AXL V: Redemption
AXL VI: A New Beginning
AXL GOES TO HELL: The Final Book
And maybe even some accompanying books.
Axl Rose's Tips To Woman Psychology
Axl Rose's 9 Ways To Eat Kraft Mac & Cheese
Axl Rose's How To Keep Your Cornrows At Their Shiniest
I'm kidding about those last few.
Re: have you ever wondered...
...if alot of Axl's animosity towards Slash comes not from the man himself but people saying for years that Axl needs Slash...and Slash needs Axl?
i just kinda wondered that today...i know if i'm not fond of something but am forced to deal with that thing day after day then i magnifies my feeling towards that particular thing or act (or even person)
I think you're onto something here, Neemo. It's like someone telling you to do something, yet you do the exact opposite for some reason. I've figured out the easiest way to try to predict what GNR will do is just to expect the exact OPPOSITE of what a normal band would do.
There's probably another untold reason why he doesn't care for him though. I think the calling out of Slash in 1989 for using heroin use caused friction in their relationship. I do think that monkeychow is correct in saying that their communication skills between one another sucked. I suspect there was a lot of frustration in both men and Slash going out and recording the Snakepit album--which was supposed to be part of the new GNR record in 1995 was probably the last straw for Axl. Conversely, when Slash returned to try to work something out with Axl, Axl never showed up on time in the studio. He also refused to speak with Slash face to face. Slash probably saw that as the sign that their relationship at that point was unworkable.
