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Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
I think this subject may be a little exaggerated. They could tour and do fine in the US. They did in 2002 and 2006, I'm sure they'd do similar numbers next time around. Are US fans more critical? I suppose, but there are plenty of fans from other countries that don't accept THIS version of GNR either. Most of the reviews from the concerts point out that fact and while their attendance numbers overseas have been pretty good, they're not exactly breaking any records or selling out shows on a nightly basis. Again, the numbers seem to be similar to previous tours.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Here in Australia, i think the reality is somewhere in the middle.
90% of people I talk to say the negative stuff Axlin08 reports above about it not being the real GNR, VR being closer and so on. It's definately a reality.
Yet at the end of the day GNR sold out a big arena in my home town two nights in a row in 2007 despite all that.
I think the situation is that the majority of the public overall wants classic GNR, but there's enough people who will take Axl on his own terms for the new band to survive indefinately.
So we won't see a return to UYI days perhaps, but you also won't see this band fail and colapse.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Completely collapse? Never. At the absolute worst they could be chased back into clubs, but I doubt it. Axl will always have theaters imo, at least.
But it won't get better either, album or no album, hit or no hit, promo or no promo.
I'm just saying that if Axl wanted to duplicate his enormous international success, it would require some personel changes.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
I'm not sure, I can't see it getting back to UYI level, but I can see it getting reasonably big, IMO Axl is only ever one massive song away from public acceptance of his new band.
Imagine a new song with the power of NR. Something that was radio friendly like that is (although it's *way* long for radio lol) that captures his lyrical abilities and voice, and something with truely epic guitar that really blows the mind.
If a song like that became a hit, while people would still want classic GNR to a degree, i think they'd come to the party as well.
What it comes down to I think, is while there's a lot of amazing guitar on the album, the basic chemesty of the band is different than the old band, all it would take is finding that blend again somehow.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
This I Love with Slash would've been November Rain II.
Imagine a new song with the power of NR.
You're talking of the same song. This I Love. It would have been massive in 91. However, now it sounds a bit "dated". I don't doubt for a second it could have been a big hit if anyone bothered. People take whatever the media tells them to take.
I think this subject may be a little exaggerated. They could tour and do fine in the US.
Yes they could. And like you say, European fans ain't *just* positive. Plenty of people being critical. Tell you what, GNR could most likely have filled a stadium if it was the old band. Axl knew they couldn't and went for a smaller arena.
I'm talking about people not going to new GN'R shows out of protest. It's not getting older.
A protest gaining what? If you wanna protest, at least have a goal. Because people want Slash back right? If that's the goal with their protest, it's a lost cause from the get-go.
How very true. I've never seen Guns N' Roses perform Guns N' Roses songs. The songs they wrote. I've just seen a cover band with the original vocalist.
I'm there for Chinese Democracy, but you see the difference between a developing band-member band such as GNR and Motley Crue playing the songs. Come on.
Exactly. So they're staying home.
Apparently their memories of GN'R are more precious, than it's reality in 2010.
And I don't get that. Do they take offense or something? No wonder we have religion. People take more offense than I'm sure old band members does sometimes. Slash even wanted to see them in 2001. It's just songs, lyrics, pyro and beer sold at the stands.
When CrashDiet lost their singer because he was an ass who killed himself, some people went mad because the rest of them got a new singer. I mean, what's that about? Really? Musical-snobbery. It's pure smelly bullshit. Don't take music that seriously.
America really wants to listen to GN'R play. The right one. And they'll accept nothing less. That's all they are saying. They are demanding a certain quality control for their GN'R, that the world does not. Like I said before, America was Guns N' Roses fans... apparently the world were Axl Rose fans.
You have a valid point, but you're polarizing it to the max. GNR can do a good tour in the States keeping Axl happy, just like they do here. It's not like the rest of us are Axl Rose fans.
The American people feel that Axl Rose has mistreated them, disrespected them, from late starts to riots to cancelled shows to hatred of former loved band members, and not given them, as a music fan and consumer what they demand. So they don't go to his concerts. Simple as that.
Aaahhh...now I'm following. If anything, this is why they stay home. But yet, they don't really stay home as a tour would prove. It's not like when you cross the Canadian border, people don't feel like that. Plenty of people do, but there's still enough people do pull of a good tour. If GNR came to Bergen again, I would assume 1/3 of the crowd would stay home due to his delay.
I've seen GNR twice, they having played three times in Norway. I don't feel abused at all. Why would some rock star abuse me because he's late on stage? There's plenty of choices to be made so I'll avoid the annoyance of it. If I was in a riot, like Vancouver, I would be more annoyed with people rioting than Axl cancelling. Who gives them the right to behave such way just because one guy is late? It doesn't justify shit, and you can't blame it on one asshole that 3000 other assholes can't deal with him.
But that's the way it goes. "Axl cancels, and we riot". One asshole generates thousands. What a scene. Like the classroom bully setting the standard.
"Oh, sorry miss...but the bully threw his desk out the window. Since he ruined the class, we all did it because we're mad at him".
But if they feel mistreated of all the reasons listed, that's a legit reason not to go. However, I still don't see what that gains in the end, despite protesting towards a product. The only thing you will generate in the end, is a band quitting doing their job. And one less GNR doesn't create more entertainment. It creates less.
Do they shake hands in the end, for a job well done? Finally getting Axl out of business and back into hiding. Yay. Great. That's one less band we have to protest against.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Do they shake hands in the end, for a job well done? Finally getting Axl out of business and back into hiding. Yay. Great. That's one less band we have to protest against.
Yeah that's what i've always felt was the problem with a 'protest vote' - boycotting CD or Gigs or anything else won't encourage Axl to give Slash a call - it will either motivate him to solider on to prove his point, or, he'll just call it a day and live off publishing in his mansion. He doesn't *need* to be making records ever again, he's doing it for the fun/art/some other reason.
Same with people who go to a show and boo or call for slash etc. Most that will happen is they'll piss of axl and cause the show to end early. There's no point to it.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
Exactly. There's just no point in it. What is there to gain from it besides making Axl stop doing what he does? They think they can force him to call Slash by not going to shows or not buying the CD's? There's absolutely NOTHING to be gained by any kind of negative actions like the ones listed above. Nothing at all. Except putting an end to entertainment given. Protest votes like that got nothing going for them. Not in this case.
Reminds me of that Stargate Universe series they got going on. The creators changed the entire series approach with the new show. The fans go nuts. Boycott it, trash talk it, whatever they can to protest. What they're REALLY doing, is putting an end to the Stargate franchise. If that isn't shooting your own leg or pissing on your feet to keep them warm, I don't know what is.
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
I am okay with Axl doing nothing. As far as I'm concerned, he's written one song worth a damn in the past 19 years. I won't lose any sleep if this band goes away forever, nor will most other people.
People are staying away because they are already not getting what they want, so why do they care if they get nothing instead? They aren't going anyway, so who really cares if there's a show or not. The threat of no Axl isn't really a threat at all.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: 2009-10 Chinese Democracy World Tour
I am okay with Axl doing nothing. As far as I'm concerned, he's written one song worth a damn in the past 19 years. I won't lose any sleep if this band goes away forever, nor will most other people.
Wow, that's a pretty strong statement.
Your opinion on that front couldn't be more diverse than mine, although it's just as valid for what it is. But for me a whole lot of his songs have touched me musically in recent years, "This I Love" just pulls on my heart strings, "Madgascar" is really quite uplifting, the lyrics to "Scraped" remind me that sometimes even people as talented as Axl feel they suck, I really enjoy rocking out to "Chinese Democracy" as a track, and "If the World" is also in pretty heavy rotation over here. Hell, the moments in "There was a Time" with those high screams are pretty much my favouite Axl moment of all the records, and I deeply love the old band too, but that moment just hits me. And then songs like "Catcher", that first demo of it alone made me want to write music.
Anyway, it's cool if you don't get anything from what he does, but I'm just saying his song writing to me contributes a whole lot to my life over the years, and I'd hate to have never heard those songs.
I'm also a huge fan of the classic band, and so clearly I'd be way into a reunion too just cos Ax+Slash have a magic together, but that's not on the table.
I'm really glad to have heard the songs Axl's written on Chinese, and i'd hate to see him retire all up, as I'm pretty sure he's capiable of writing a lot more magic over the years whoever is in the band. To me the worst possible outcome is Axl doing nothing.
