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- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
The public wants what they consider to be the real GnR. Nothing Axl or Azoff does is going to change that. I said this years ago: very, very few kids are looking for a man approaching 50 to save rock.
Hmmm...I think at the moment you are correct in that while the new era stuff has its own fan base, the public at large, in general probably considers it not the real GNR. However I disagree that this is an unchangable situation. A large proportion of the public are slaves to the media and basicly sheep to fashion...there is an extent to which people will swallow what they are sold...the problem with new-guns is that it's not being effectively sold to them. I mean the old records and image was massive...nothing was done to effectively change that impression - other than a few apperances and now an album not properly marketed and promoted.
IMO...if the band functioned more like a 'normal' band for a period of time, that is, had a secure line up, did a few tours, released a couple of albums, made media apperances, had group photos, generally acted in a way that any other commerical band does, then people could become interested in this band, and become real fans of it. Sure, it might never be the 1991 level of stardom again...but it could be given some legitimacy to the public.
Take Ac/Dc....i've lost count of the number of kids I see in Black Ice tops around here...Brian Johnson is 61 years old. Is he saving rock? No. Is he considered legit even to today's kids. Seems so. Does being 61 stop his record kicking ass? No. Is bon scott the 'real' singer of Ac/Dc? Maybe so...but is Brian an accepted part of Ac? Yep. He's paid his dues.
It could be the same in GNR. The 'real' GNR will always be the AFD gang. And that won't change. But if Axl, Bumble and the boys release enough music, market it to the masses the right way, and generally play the game...eventually people will come to the party, and accept them in the way Brian Johnson is. Maybe he's not the same...but he works. Ac/Dc also had an 8 year absence recently I note. The only real differences are the way GNR approach things it seems. They're not selling it right IMO. So the only people that really get sold are those like some of us who've discovered it on their own and loved the songs. But the general public needs to be better handled if they're worried about sales and so on.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
AC/DC is completely different. AC/DC lost one guy in a band that was known, but not huge 5 years before video even made who was in a band common knowledge. Fast forward to the video era where GnR was for a short period of time the biggest in the world now replacing every single person other than the singer from their landmark album that used videos to identify who they were. It's not even apples and oranges. Journey, Styx, Motley Crue, Poison...the list goes on and on for 80s bands that were never given a chance without the lineup that made the band famous. Had Bon died post AC/DC really making it, they would have had the same fate with Brian Johnson.
Video changed all the rules - names suddenly had faces beyond the lead singer. Once that happened, it changed the entire complexion of the music industry in so many ways.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
Not sure it's right though. In australia Ac/Dc's rise to fame was heavily associated with their playing on Television here...on a tv show called countdown...people knew who bon was...plus...Highway to Hell was #17 in the usa charts....so it's not like AC/Dc didn't become famous until after his death.
I think the major difference is Ac/Dc have done a much better job at selling the line up change to the public.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
Buzz is right in a sense, and Axl himself even said it back in 2002 after the VMA appearance. This has never been done before. Rebuilding an entire band. Sure other bands have had lineup changes, but I can't remember any band ever having major success, then changing everything save for one or two members (if you want to count Dizzy), taking 8 years off and then going back and forth in and out of the spotlight for the next 7 years. A lot of time has passed and it was naive to think that they could just pick up right where they left off in 1993. Although, I think monkeychow makes some valid points too. IF the music and band was marketed in certain ways it's possible they could achieve some level of success. Certainly not at the level of the UYI days, but far more than we've seen since CD's release.
Time will tell if a serious effort is made, then, and only then, will we see if it is possible.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
Not sure it's right though. In australia Ac/Dc's rise to fame was heavily associated with their playing on Television here...on a tv show called countdown...people knew who bon was...plus...Highway to Hell was #17 in the usa charts....so it's not like AC/Dc didn't become famous until after his death.
I think the major difference is Ac/Dc have done a much better job at selling the line up change to the public.
No one's saying they weren't famous before his death.
Yeah there is Bon Scott footage obviously. I used to have a VHS tape years ago with tons of shit on it. However, NONE of this was being played on MTV in the early/mid 80s. What ACDC vids were being played then? Back in Black-Who Made Who era. So while Highway to Hell, Girls Got Rhythm, Jailbreak,etc. were being cranked in stereos across the planet, the visual image being presented was the post Bon Scott era.
Most of this Bon era footage was not given a mainstream release and/or push until the Johnson era was firmly cemented in pop culture.
Coincidence? I think not.
Edit:
While on the topic of AC/DC, I have to say it was BRILLIANT marketing to promote Angus as the "figure head" of the band. Both eras. Besides the obvious video influence, I think this played a role in the success of the transition as well. He is featured prominently on the Highway to Hell band photo album cover, while the next few album covers did not have band photos on them.
Genius.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
I've seen a video for "Jailbreak" on VH1 Classic with Bon Scott and the boys in it. Don't know exactly when that was released, but it was made. Videos just weren't a big deal back then, so obviously the Brian Johnson era band was going to get more visual attention.
You're right on with Angus being the face for the band, and someone to catch the public's eye. Sort of like 
.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
I've seen a video for "Jailbreak" on VH1 Classic with Bon Scott and the boys in it. Don't know exactly when that was released, but it was made. Videos just weren't a big deal back then, so obviously the Brian Johnson era band was going to get more visual attention.
I remember seeing a quote from one of the members of Aerosmith talking about doing videos before Mtv.
Something to the effect of, "We made videos then. We just didn't call them videos, we called them commercials."
They were done for promo, but had no real place to play them.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
Yeaj i think maybe it was different in the usa too. I'm just saying AC/DC were huge here in oz...because they kept being on TV...not on MTV but on our national broadcaster's rock shows of the time...live apperances and stuff....
Anyway...i'm just saying - Ac/Dc is a band with a front man who is 61 years old, that's had an 8 year absence, and without it's original line up, that's managed to maintain respect in community.
And in my opinion a lot of it is marketing and branding, the new band is based around Angus and Brian (those are like the only two who move on stage lol), they give interviews, are in pics together, promote the shit out of their products etc etc.
Old GNR was kinda the Axl and Slash show, and I feel that part of the critizm now becomes that it's Axl and his friends kinda thing, because a new band image has not been kinda maketed correctly to the masses.
Obvious GNR and Ac/Dc have some differences too, but I feel with the correct marketing, and the right promotional tools, and if a few other thigns were done, then a new GNR could be packaged in a way that it would be accepted by the public. But these things have not always been done. Which get back to my original point which is kinda that I read a lot from us fans about problems in the creative process and issues with the album, but In my opinion the music is fantasic...it's the business and managment side of the GNR machine that has been catastrophic. Just my opinion.
Re: Brain in Modern Drummer (May 2009)
All the promotion in the world wouldn't change anything. This is not AC/DC - not even close - even if you ignore the different eras. Anything short of Axl and Slash will not equal GnR to the public, therefore will not be accepted, nor will it sell. CD = Contraband...some sales due to the curiosity factor. If there is a next album, consider it Libertad (which I like, but it was clearly a failure). They could promote the shit out of whatever band they have together at the moment and it wouldn't matter. Half of them weren't featured on the existing album and if there's ever another album, half of them won't be on that album either. And nobody is waiting 15 years for another Axl Rose record, so anyone that thinks they can rebuild the hype is mistaken.
The album that just came out only really has Axl, Tommy, Dizzy and Pitman making significant contributions with other additions forced in here and there for some reason that is completely beyond comprehension. Until otherwise proven, there's no Brain, huge, BH, or Finck in GnR anymore. There are as many contributors still in the band as there are out of it. There's no way you can compare this to AC/DC, which really became famous after Bon died. The best AC/DC / GnR comparison would be the Ole Bach era to the AFD era.
