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Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
It's Friday, everyone. Dive in and find the monkey.
I disappeared down the rabbit hole this morning after reading your & apex's posts, combing thru articles all the way back to '87. Fuck. Total waste of a morning.
Why should any of them ever do anything again?
These are street kids we are talking about ... little to no education that made it huge in a 4 year span...
If it were me I'd have retired a long fucking time ago lol ... want something from me? Too fucking bad Cya ...but he had a contract to fulfill
I think Axl underestimated chemistry and commraderie in those "lost years" as a group of urchins living under the street they had nothing to lose and tons of ambition
As millionaire Rockstars they didn't need to do anything else...he maybe assumed/hoped that the new group he brought in had the same drive and chemistry...they didnt and neither did he so i think shit just got put off endlessly
No, I get that. I'm just saying that I think that was actually part of it, part of the reason for CD's gestation. In fact I think it was part of the plan - part of the point of [him] wanting to be a rock star is to live on his/your own terms. It partially explains the lack of momentum.
One of the reasons I was trawling thru interviews this morning is because I vaguely remember Axl saying something along those lines way back. I'm pretty sure it was about AFD & how he wanted to make one album that would have a lasting impact. I thought it was from a Sylvie Simmons interview but the closest thing to it I can find is the Mick Wall piece from '91 where he says if things go right "we won't have to make another album for 5 years". 5 years!
My point was he had maybe/obviously(?) reached a level of success/financial comfort that contributed to the problems, & that was in his nature from the get go.
The fire's long since gone out.
Makes me doubt his sincerity: if he'd really cared he'd have found a way to get music released.
Easy to point fingers and blame record companies and suits. But if the energy is dulled then you're already on the backfoot.
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
I disappeared down the rabbit hole this morning after reading your & apex's posts, combing thru articles all the way back to '87. Fuck. Total waste of a morning.
I don't know why but my obsession starts in 1997, going back past that and I just glaze over.
I found most of the Birdwatch photos but not the one you mentioned.
Makes me doubt his sincerity: if he'd really cared he'd have found a way to get music released.
That and it makes me question the vault material being good / finished.
I think Axl tried to time the market with CD which explains the constant revising of the material. He wanted his lost love missives to be contemporary. So even if CD2 was conceivably good, it's showing up to the nu-metal industrial party 15 years after that party was over. He also probably wasn't keen on signing up for a repeat crucifixion anytime soon.
He should've gotten back with Slash the minute Robin walked but ya know, throw it on the pile.
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
I`m sure there is some brilliant stuff left in the vault. I refuse to believe 7 very talented musicians Axl, Robin, Bucket, Paul, Tommy, Chris and Brain worked on subpar material.
The question is how much of what`s left in the vault is finished and whether Axl will bother to release anything ever again after the debacle that was the whole Chinese Democracy saga.
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
I quite like Silkworms and Oh My God.
I think they're hardcore rock tracks that come off as effortless and have something to say. It's a shame they're not well liked. Riad gets more of a pass because of it's Zeppelin influence but that's another underrated tune. This said, those aren't A-Listers.
The question is what the lead singles were. I wouldn't put scratch on Jackie Chan fitting alongside your industrio-rockers. The General is supposedly a third record song which is curious considering it was likely once the opener for the record. Atlas is probably a good Street of Dreams stand-in. Besides that we don't know diddly and the lack of any information about them is fairly disconcerting.
I'm not sure how much I can put stock in Buckethead's contributions either. The stuff he churned out has strong melodies, the through lines are rock solid, but to me, they don't really sound much like GN'R. It sounds like Buckets N' Roses. It's also possible that the material is strong instrumentally but are as approached as half-assedly as Scraped which saw Axl scrambling to finish his cereal before he missed the bus.
There's also the question of theme. Did Axl's muse show a different face than "how to make an album amidst breaking up with girlfriends and band members" in subsequent songwriting sessions?
- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
Am I the only one that watched that 1988 Tokyo show I posted? Fuck that was amazing.
- dalethirsty
- Rep: 20
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
so far we got:
- slash playing the intro riff to cd in 1988
- axl teasing prostitute as the intro to november rain in 01/02 (and 06/07?)
- a piece of the general being used as a show opener (when was this again?)
i read somewhere on this forum that if the world was being jammed by the band at live shows at some point... anyone have any more info on that?
anything else i'm missing from the list above?
i wonder what else is out there that we haven't picked up on yet. perhaps that duet from finck and bucket at rock in rio 3 was something being worked on for the album. or maybe it's just a little jam over the "i could have lied" riff by the chili peppers. or it could just be an outtake from colma/electric tears.
i might go back and listen to all the various band jams throughout the years and see if anything jumps out at me.
i also wonder if bucket/brain jammed on some cool shit that never really went anywhere in gnr land, so they used parts of it elsewhere in their own music. we've heard tons of reports about the late night jam sessions that went down, where the band just dicked around on stuff waiting for axl to show up. i mean, if something made its way into axl's ears, i don't think it could realistically (or legally) be repurposed outside of guns n' roses... but for the "sketches" that were just vamped on a few times... i could see pieces of stuff like that popping up in bucket's solo stuff, even if it is just a lick or riff here and there.
the bermuda triangle album by buckethead is a really curious release. a rare electronic-based album from buckethead, with lots of programming, samples and drum loops. the song "whatevas" in particular sounds a lot like the direction axl was trying to take with cd. i could totally see axl taking this and running with it. great, melodic solo by the way -- sounds a lot like his work on the album:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aloOXwdTVg
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
so far we got:
- slash playing the intro riff to cd in 1988
- axl teasing prostitute as the intro to november rain in 01/02 (and 06/07?)
- a piece of the general being used as a show opener (when was this again?)
They used The General as an intro in 2002 and not again until 2009-2010 IIRC.
They also played If The World as a band jam in 2006. Another jam was probably Atlas Shrugged.
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
Prostitute '06
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLWIYDa2-gc
Since '02, Axl's alternated between two distinct intros to NR; one being Prostitute and the other one being this.
Get this. Axl thinks NR is a big deal to him as a composer. It's a very old song of his and after it got the Guns treatment, it became quite a hit. Bearing that in mind, Axl must've ranked his piano work on Prostitute highly to play it, incognito, before his crown jewel. Whatever the other bit is, I doubt it's just something he threw together on a whim.
- dalethirsty
- Rep: 20
Re: Chinese Democracy in 1988
good shit!
i really think there may be something with the piano arrangements played by both axl and dizzy in all the different tours throughout the years. dizzy played a lot of really interesting things when he had a chance to solo -- who knows if we'll ever be able to confirm if the material was slated for an official release or not.
and i really wish this man had more of a chance to pen some gnr tracks. truly an underrated talent:
