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Re: Official band pic
elevendayempire wrote:I think of 2002 as the "iconic" CD-era line-up. Buckethead, Finck, Fortus, Dizzy, Pitman, Stinson, Brain and Axl. It felt like they'd ironed out the kinks and locked down a stable unit; unfortunately they never got to crystallise around the release of the album.
I'd love to hear from the ones involved what happened inside the band after the 2002 tour imploded and Bucket exiting, in 2004.
Well, the RTB / Tom Zutaut album was erased.
"The band, our two engineers [Caram Costanzo and Eric Caudieux], myself, [and] most importantly, Axl... have been working on the actual album for the last two years [from early 2003]." (Merck, 03/06/05)
"It went through Sean Beavan, Roy Thomas Baker and then I guess Axl is the producer now." (Brain, EQ TV, 10/08)
So, this begs the question, was 2002 about Axl having emotional issues with then-CD - produced by his now-enemies RTB and Zoot? Did that make him have cold feet about completing and releasing it at the time? Because his response to the ignominious tour cancellation was to re-do everything - instead of pushing it out.
Imagine the sighs going around the band. Those same old songs.
Re: Official band pic
(And just WHAT the hell happened with that 2002 tour? I still don't think we've heard a straight answer on that...)
I so want to hear those earlier versions.
Especially 'The Blues', before it got neutered.
And a hi-fi version of the 'May' solo on Catcher.
Re: Official band pic
I'd love to hear earlier versions of the songs. They're all way better.
I wonder if there's an old version of the Blues that sounds like it did on tour. It was more electro but also had this up-tempo thing to it.
And didn't Buckethead play on Catcher or was that just speculation?
Those alternate cuts are like my holy grail. It sucks when your favorite band is a band that hasn't existed for 14 years!
Re: Official band pic
I've always wanted to hear the original demo of the title track. The song existed before Bucket joined and I'd like to hear it even if its shit. The versions of IRS and TWAT are terrible without him but that CITR demo was great.
I've also wanted to hear a studio version of the 2001-02 version of The Blues. An incredible song that was neutered in 2006.
There has to be a version of Catcher that includes Bucket. Ron was just pasted into the track like on the others. It couldn't have went from the 99 version with May straight to that horrid mess.
- elevendayempire
- Rep: 96
Re: Official band pic
I've always wanted to hear the original demo of the title track. The song existed before Bucket joined and I'd like to hear it even if its shit.
I'm guessing it sounds pretty much exactly like the Vegas/RIR III performances; they don't have the added Buckethead solos, and he doesn't really do much else during the song.
Re: Official band pic
(And just WHAT the hell happened with that 2002 tour? I still don't think we've heard a straight answer on that...)
That tour was on planning stages already in 2001. Doug Goldstein's Big FD merged with Sanctuary Group - thus came in Merck Mercuriadis, and they convinced ClearChannel to take on Guns' US comeback tour. Axl got a $1 million advance for the tour alone. This was big business, on paper, anyway.
During their big negotiations, the band was re-recording at Village and inhaling dog-poo odours, because their star guitarist was having a laugh. Axl shielded his band from the business side, I'll give him that.
When the US dates was happening, these separate worlds collided. Axl had his own issues and lacked an album, kicking it off at the infamous 02 VMAs. The tour was selling slow in places and began with a riot. We could argue the routing was faulty with too many slow markets during the week and that Axl was given too much leeway on everything. But how it seems to me is that both parties (Axl and ClearChannel) got fed up with their joint venture, for opposing reasons, perhaps.
In 2012, Axl admitted he cancelled the Philly show, but went to say that ClearChannel had their own issues in Florida. Guns were to play there the week after. This suggests the promoters had began looking into pulling the plug. In all fairness, the tour had began to pick up on momentum, with fair attendance in population centers like Toronto, Boston and NYC. Too little, too late for CC?
Axl himself had visible issues with being out there. Just look at those oversized jerseys and tantrums thrown on stage; hardly the signs of a happy bunny. The rumble he would've gotten was that tour was selling poorly and dates were about to be axed. A major reason would've been the lack of an album, and henceforth, record company backing in tour promotion and whatnot. Axl would've been between a rock and a hard place, if he insisted on holding on to the album.
The MSG show was sold out in 10 minutes. Axl said during the show that the brisk demand for tickets "really helped things out". He went all in and delivered his best show on the tour. It's plausible he indeed got sick - having given his all to what was supposed be a redeeming show, he would've still looked at getting shafted by the promoters, due to overall lackluster sales and his erratic behaviour. Stress factor plays a part, he could've found himself succumbed by the pressure after the show and decided to skip Philly.
Axl had cancelled shows in the past for lesser reasons; he knew he could try it on, to send a message to CC. Here's where the narrative gets tricky. Axl said he informed Doug Goldstein about his illness at 6AM, on the day of the Philly show. "Cancel it, I'm sick." Apparently, Dougie goes, "Whatever, a good nights' sleep and he's fine with the show again." 15 hours later, the reality of the situation hit Goldstein. "He's not coming," he informed the Philly venue.
The riot happened, in Axl's version, because the management failed to take note of his illness and cancel the show during the day. They were seemingly hoping this was just another tantrum in the string of many, and that Axl would hop into the helicopter come nightfall and do the show, business as usual. ClearChannel had the 'One strike and you're out' policy in place for Axl, as the next Philly show was cancelled on the day after.
This all points out to ClearChannel and Axl having come to blows, with the management stuck in the middle, hoping to keep things going, because tour means income and cancellations - if squared on Axl - would mean litigations. I maintain there was some element of powerplay involved with the Philly shows; the promoters may have brought in the bad news for Axl, who was already on dire straits. He might've kept on touring had they permitted him, but the post-MSG illness gave them the perfect excuse to boot him out.
In any case, it's likely a more convoluted story than just watching basketball during the show.
Re: Official band pic
James Lofton wrote:I've always wanted to hear the original demo of the title track. The song existed before Bucket joined and I'd like to hear it even if its shit.
I'm guessing it sounds pretty much exactly like the Vegas/RIR III performances; they don't have the added Buckethead solos, and he doesn't really do much else during the song.
The HOB version is my favorite version of the track.....second favorite is Boston 2002.....then the 'demo'.......then the album version.
That 2001-02 lineup knew what to do with that song. No surprise it got worse as that lineup fell apart.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P9qTtiH8uA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA8WTRuSd8I
