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Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
buzzsaw wrote:There are other ways of helping them than just getting them off drugs. There were other ways he could have altered the arrangement without taking complete control of everything. I don't disagree that something needed to be done; I disagree with what Axl decided to do.
Neither one of us was there so we don't know how bad it was.
Axl decided it was bad enough to take an extreme measure, his insurance to keep the brand alive.
But you seem to want to give S&D slack even though their behavior gravely contributed to the power play. They really have no one to blame but themselves. For letting it get so bad. For signing that contract. For letting people into the circle who could destroy the band.
At the end of the day, I am thankful they signed that document because I don't this group had the tolerance to make another record as a unit.
Easy there...Axl let more people into the circle that could destroy the band than anybody else did. You might want to edit that comment out too.
- killingvector
- Rep: 21
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
Easy there...Axl let more people into the circle that could destroy the band than anybody else did. You might want to edit that comment out too.
Nope, I am fine with it.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
They've all lied
Do you have proof of this? I can only remember one, Slash saying he never went to Axls house.
Finally, I never proclaimed that Axl has not lied. One example: He clearly announced a release period for Chinese on at least two occasions and also clearly never intended to deliver.
No proof those were lies.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
buzzsaw wrote:Easy there...Axl let more people into the circle that could destroy the band than anybody else did. You might want to edit that comment out too.
Nope, I am fine with it.
Well, the Malibu Mafia appreciates your support.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
Axlin12 wrote:They've all lied
Do you have proof of this? I can only remember one, Slash saying he never went to Axls house.
killingvector wrote:Finally, I never proclaimed that Axl has not lied. One example: He clearly announced a release period for Chinese on at least two occasions and also clearly never intended to deliver.
No proof those were lies.
*just basics*
Slash lied about the house thing. Slash has lied about how he left the band. Slash has lied about Axl's behavior (it's been inconsistent, and countered his own stories). Axl lied about CD. Axl's lied about One In A Million. Axl's lied about Slash's departure (based on Slash and everyone else's story, or is he telling the truth, and 5 other guys are lying?) Duff's story has changed a couple times dating back a decade or so, specifically on the time frame and how the name was lost to Axl. Steven is Steven = duh. Matt = Steven II. Gilby's story has changed a few times over depending on who's ass he's kissing, when he was trying to work VR for a job, then work Axl for a job. Dizzy's lied several times about CD.
Izzy is the only one non-related to the GN'R thing. He doesn't talk much, and when he does he's been pretty consistent that Axl was a facist dictator, but the rest were also problematic, and that he didn't agree with the Steven firing, and when Steven was gone, it was over for him.
The stuff Izzy has been inconsistent on is HIS stuff, related to GN'R business, drug use, whether or not he kicked Vince Neil's girl, etc.
Do I have all of the articles in front of me? No. I'm not taking a time portal back over 20 years.
"I'm not your personal Google" as a great man once said on this board.
The point is -- NONE of them are trustworthy. I tend to believe Duff the most, but he earned that over the last few years. During his VR days, I wouldn't believe a word from him.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
There are other ways of helping them than just getting them off drugs. There were other ways he could have altered the arrangement without taking complete control of everything. I don't disagree that something needed to be done; I disagree with what Axl decided to do.
Not really. Either they have equal say or they don't. If they die, which at the time was a perfectly reasonable assumption, he will be stuck with negotiating about business and band matters with a bunch of self serving heirs. Ask Nirvana and the Beatles how fun that can be.
And just because they're junkies doesn't mean they're shooting heroin before a show or are so drunk to not know what they're doing. Basically Goldstein came and told them Axl wanted them to sign over the rights because in their state they couldn't be trusted with the responsibility, probably also followed with a little *wink*wink* from Doug as to what might happen if they didn't.
Sneaky, dickish, manipulative yeah, but if you're gonna sign over the rights to a multi million dollar enterprise just because you're too pussy to take one of Axls semi regular no shows you got it coming.
And that's probably whey they never made a huge fuzz about it in later years. They knew he was right and they knew they'd not been tricked into anything. Pushed for sure, but that's something else entirely. As they say in football, shoulder to shoulder is not a foul.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
buzzsaw wrote:There are other ways of helping them than just getting them off drugs. There were other ways he could have altered the arrangement without taking complete control of everything. I don't disagree that something needed to be done; I disagree with what Axl decided to do.
Not really. Either they have equal say or they don't. If they die, which at the time was a perfectly reasonable assumption, he will be stuck with negotiating about business and band matters with a bunch of self serving heirs. Ask Nirvana and the Beatles how fun that can be.
I'm sure lawyers could have figured out a way to make it work if they would have put an effort into it. There's a middle ground somewhere.
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
Axlin:
I know of most the stories you talk about, but I think most of them can be attributed to misrepresenting the facts, hide your part in vague descriptions and bad memory. They're all guilty of this, but the Slash thing is the only one I remember where you can say it's a blatant lie.
Everybody will construe their stories to serve themselves, but that's different from pure lying. That's why I'm asking for proof.
- killingvector
- Rep: 21
Re: RRHoF Discussion (Izzy/Slash/Axl Press Statements)
buzzsaw wrote:There are other ways of helping them than just getting them off drugs. There were other ways he could have altered the arrangement without taking complete control of everything. I don't disagree that something needed to be done; I disagree with what Axl decided to do.
Not really. Either they have equal say or they don't. If they die, which at the time was a perfectly reasonable assumption, he will be stuck with negotiating about business and band matters with a bunch of self serving heirs. Ask Nirvana and the Beatles how fun that can be.
And just because they're junkies doesn't mean they're shooting heroin before a show or are so drunk to not know what they're doing. Basically Goldstein came and told them Axl wanted them to sign over the rights because in their state they couldn't be trusted with the responsibility, probably also followed with a little *wink*wink* from Doug as to what might happen if they didn't.
Sneaky, dickish, manipulative yeah, but if you're gonna sign over the rights to a multi million dollar enterprise just because you're too pussy to take one of Axls semi regular no shows you got it coming.
And that's probably whey they never made a huge fuzz about it in later years. They knew he was right and they knew they'd not been tricked into anything. Pushed for sure, but that's something else entirely. As they say in football, shoulder to shoulder is not a foul.
Remember though, it was an escape clause. Axl could leave with the name whenever he wanted. The old partnership continued to exist right up to the time that Axl executed the contract in 95.
